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Misunderstanding Alert. I didn't say what was wrong with the patient, b/c that wasn't the purpose of my quip. I don't post when I cut a trauma victims clothes off.. There was swelling, bilaterally, they were stretched so tight I just barely got the tip of the pen cap/pocket doo hickey under them. I cut them so as to restore color and use to the hands. I was just sharing my story of how I coined battle scared silly bandz. They're annoying. If the patient already had them on "tightly" b/c of arm size, consider what will happen if the extremities swell. Thanks for assuming I hate the patient b/c the patient wears black. Thanks for making me feel bad, I should have said that I cut them off b/c it was medically necessary. But since it's a big fad now, I thought I'd share my first experience with silly bandz. They stretch, but not enough, dozens of tiny tourniquets.. I've been an EMT for eleven years, paid and volunteer. Never had one complaint from a patient. I have my own way to go about things, I'm big on the statement in our protocols that allow to form them for the best care of the patient. I like to be able to go home and ask myself if I did the right things, and I did that best I could. The same protocols, b/c they aren't shaped for rural EMS, ended my week badly. They didn't allow me to save my patient, b/c of a technicality.. I thought this was a funny story, not too often can you get a funny bit out of a horrible situation. They don't teach how you talk to someone who doesn't want to see tomorrow. Nowhere does it say that I didn't like the patient. The pt., lacked appreciation of life, per se. I tried to pull them off, got one of those cause bands off. But the others were screamin', said I'll buy ya new ones kid, but they're coming off. I do that sometimes, if someone says it's my only good pair or.. or my only good.. I feel guilty and offer, once I obliged. I got called stuff that would make a preacher faint. The pt. was pissed, but when I told the pt. what (the pt) could do with them now, well that was funny, and it opened a rapport, more info was spilled out, and that was that. But nobody wants to hear about that.

If you cut someone's property without an imminent medical need, you're really not thinking clearly and just being a douche. Sorry. You can dislike the "emo kid" and all his jelly bracelets... but unless you can't get them off without cutting, you have no right to destroy his property. What's wrong with you? If there's a medical need, you do as little damage as possible but do what needs to be done. If there's no medical need, and the original post doesn't really indicate whether or not there was, then keep your scissors to yourself. I'm actually really disgusted by this... is it OK to cut off someone's coat because you don't like the designer? Because you think it makes them stuck up? Where do you draw the line here? Wendy CO EMT-B

I had spoken with Bill (Retread) a few weeks ago, and he said then he wasn't doing very well. He had CHF, and was on leave from work as his health was deteriorating. My condolences and prayers to his family, and his many friends. Obituary from http://www.pennlive.com/perry-county-times/index.ssf/2010/05/obituaries_-_27_may_2010.html WILLIAM H. GRINDLE II William H. “Bill” Grindle II, 65, of W. Main Street, New Bloomfield, died Tuesday, May 18, 2010 in Holy Spirit Hospital, Camp Hill. He was born Sept. 1, 1944 in Elizabeth, N.J., to the late William H. Sr. and Marie Agnes (Flaherty) Grindle. He was employed as a park ranger at Colonel Denning State Park, Newville, a retired teacher with the Harrisburg School District and a former deputy game protector; a Vietnam-era Army veteran; and a member of New Bloomfield Fire Company and Ambulance for many years. Surviving are his wife, Diane (Pugliese) Grindle; four daughters, Meghan Weaver of Mt. Pleasant Mills, Jessica Grindle, at home, Marie Catherine Marquez of Turbotville and Angela Stoner of Duncannon; three grandchildren, Olivia Weaver, Jack Weaver and Aliyah Marquez; a brother, John R.; and a niece and nephew, Heather Grindle Platt and Scott Grindle. Services were held May 23 in Boyer Funeral Home, New Bloomfield, with the Rev. James Gold officiating. Burial, with military honors by New Bloomfield VFW Post 7463, was in Indiantown Gap National Cemetery, Annville.

What the hell are these things the kids are wearing on their wrists? Had one that was wearing at least fifty of these Silly Bands on each arm, in addition to a number of "cause" bracelets. I cut them all off, instantly pissed off. But my first aid for 'emo bandz', is telling them to knot them back together and call them "battle scarred bandz". So, I hereby coin that phrase, but feel free to use it in order to calm them down. HA HA lolz

Oh Retread.... One of my most fond memories of Retread or Retired as I called him....I was in Mexico on my tour and I was sicker than a dog I mean it hurt to even think let alone laugh well retread came in and he was havin one of those flu's that did that to ya well....he started tellin a joke and before long we were both laughin so hard we couldt breath it hurt so bad and it was so bad that my host family came up to check on me and see if I was ok. Well I finally got over that and he got over his flu but no matter what we always shared a bond from that. We spoke of that time often and would always get a kick out of it. Retread I know your drivin that big caddylance in the sky but I hope oyu will always remember the joy that you brought us....

RIP Brother! Condolences to Bill's family. He was a good man. I remember talking to Retred many times in chat. There were a couple of bad calls that I talked to him about either PM or video that he helped me put in perspective. He had a lot of knowledge and was willing to share with those who were willing to listen and learn. EMS lost a good man with Bill's passing.

I spoke in video-voice chat with him on many occasions. I grew up in EMS, taught to value what senior providers had to offer. Which is why I consider myself a student for life. I don't think I'd be the provider I am today, if it weren't for folks like (Retread). I enjoyed our conversations very much. We may not ever meet each other, but each of us take away a little bond with the folks we get to know on here. I'll truly miss, Bill for his sense of humor, knowledge and advice.

My deepest and most sincere condolences to Bill's family in their loss. There were many times that he and I talked, and he was a great listener, knowledgeable and just a great guy that I feel honored to call 'friend'. He and I had a running joke in chat about how he resembled a cross seection of Captain Kangaroo and Alan Hale, Jr. I used to jokingly call him Cap'n Gran'pa. He had an inate ability to say the right thing at the right time to bring a smile to your face. If you had a problem, he was always at the front of the line, ready to listen and offer whatever support he could. He made it very clear that his family was the center of his life, and he loved telling me/us about his grandchildren. My prayers are with his family in their time of sadness. Brett (Lone Star)

Yeah, nice rant. Again, you have FAILED to give any information that has been requested from you. I think this is a game for you.

What was "Goth" a decade ago, is "Emotion" now. Emo. Nemo is that fish. It's a cultural style, has a different meaning to everyone.

I personally think people grossly jumped to conclusions on this. If it makes you feel better, I understood where you were going with it. Way to explain yourself anyway though. edit: rewording

I wanna know how to make a traction splint, with a SAM Splint.

Wendy, great post. I am in agreement with all posters who have said that if it compromises patient care, it goes. I don't agree with cutting clothing items unless there is a medical need for it. I have had patients who didn't want clothing cut (anyone ever cut cowboy boots off a bull rider?). Most of the time, it only take a minute to explain the reason why you need to do a certain intervention, including giving an IV, and the alternatives if they choose to refuse that intervention. Usually, after the explanation, the patient is cooperative. Part of patient care is dealing with their personal space in a professional manner, and dealing with their emotional care as well as their physical care. If we get to the point where we are rude to a patient just because we can be in our position of authority at that moment, it is time to consider stepping back and taking a break from the profession for a bit. Yes, we all have our days where we have had more than our share of idiot patients and we have ended our shift with extreme frustration.. it happens... but when we can't put that behind us and treat the next patient with professionalism, it is time to go.

I agree tsk.....sorry gotta go...go buy 50 more when you get Discharged.....

If these bands or anything else is in the way or compromising to patient care it gets removed by any means necessary. However the key here is compromising to patient care. If I need to start an IV they need to go.

Obviously, someone is lacking the skills needed in order to communicate with their pts.....

Cost. Can't put a price on a life, but you gotta be able to afford equipment, in bulk.

Any particular reason why I got the negative two posts up? Watch the video, go the the 3 minute 6 second mark and take a good look at that patient's exposed groin. Not a very good representation IMO.

Hooray to the NREMT for successfully rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

Forum, I am sorry for a late reply to the thread. These last few weeks have been busy. Thanks all for your replies, here is mine… Hmmm, these define us, I agree, how do you think this ties into the meaning or purpose of our existence? A majority of answers I am finding are saying that we are here to better our world. That does seem noble. I think it was Ruff who said it was stupid to think we can all change the world, although some may reach that mark, we have a better chance to enrich our own corner. I can agree with that. Tom, I thought getting smacked with a goth Barbie hanging from the rafters was a bit more ridiculous than this discussion, but, then again, you might get more pleasure from goth Barbie… Interesting though that we are here solely to exist and evolve. So, when we get better at surviving, and evolve becoming greater and greater, isn’t manipulation of nature just another step of it? What are the so called laws of nature we must or should obey? I agree and disagree with you to an extent about defining good and bad. I am probably not going to be able to explain myself well, but I hope you get my point. Without being able to define good or bad, we are left with neutral. Neutral does not give much of a reaction in response to an event. A bear charges at you… neutral, it just is. Your child is screaming in pain from being in a car wreck…neutral, it just is You just had the best goth Barbie beating from the rafters… neutral, no point in relishing this moment I guess what I am getting at is there is has to be good and bad in order to extract feelings. Seem that without good or bad, we will not have much of a driving force to make change. So, I guess that is where I disagree with your opinion that we should not define good and bad. I do agree that we should not occupy ourselves with the definitions though. Much time can be wasted with the practice. For sure. Wendy, I always love to see your comments, but as we have discussed before, you know I am going to disagree. I get the impression that your argument is that God exists, and that no matter how you view existence, except the denial that God exists, that your relationship with God is just too complicated to truly understand? Please correct me, I’m probably wrong. The thing is religion is based on faith. I have faith that goth barbies are going to take over the world and kill all of human kind, doesn’t mean it is going to happen, just like a greater plan is not guaranteed. To the bold statement, this is what I think the answer is to define our existence. I have no clue what it is, I just find it interesting to think about. I try not to spend all my time thinking about it, as it could become pathologic, but I find it interesting none the less. To the rest of your post, which I edited how much was quoted, did you just give points to the non-religious argument? ………………………………………………………………… I am not certain why we are here. I do feel the desire to make changes for the better in life, to be a moral and ethical person, but I have no clue why. I wanted to see where other stood on this discussion. I love you all for the responses. I apologize that I don’t really have an opinion, but, should I think of one, I will do my best to share it with you folks. Matty

Of course I knew that incomplete training would expose the general public to injury hazards. I also knew that the main function of the EMA Licensing Board is to protect the public. The Board has an important role in ensuring all practitioners involved with pre-hospital emergency care comply with the Emergency and Health Services Act. This provides assurance to the public that competent, consistent, appropriate and timely care will be available during medical emergencies. My real occupation is Construction Safety, and as a Construction Safety Officer, I cannot ignore a process that intentionally obstructs and impeades with the process to hold paramount the safety, health and welfare of the public. I was hoping a few Paramedics would be more supportive. Of course I knew that incomplete training would expose the general public to injury hazards. I also knew that the main function of the EMA Licensing Board is to protect the public. The Board has an important role in ensuring all practitioners involved with pre-hospital emergency care comply with the Emergency and Health Services Act. This provides assurance to the public that competent, consistent, appropriate and timely care will be available during medical emergencies. My real occupation is Construction Safety, and as a Construction Safety Officer, I cannot ignore a process that intentionally obstructs and impeades with the process to hold paramount the safety, health and welfare of the public. I was hoping a few Paramedics would be more supportive. The school has been shut down for 1.5 years. How long would it take for this to be excessive?

It was a combination of skills to address airway issues. However, the protocol is irelevant. The fact that it was not taught in class is serious.

hate to say it snoop but if something goes wrong and you dont report it you just as at fault so you better do something. Also what if there testing you to see if you would be a good employee so you should really say something

Improvisitation is the difference between a shitbag medic and a doc (In the Army) 4 sam splints is what we carry in our bag. You can splint a femoral fracture with it then provide traction on the ends to splint a femoral fracture. Its the only splint we got, but when my guys knock on my door and someone broke their arm playing football, i always splint it with a SAM

Your eagerness to cut off clothing which you find trivial because of your intolerance of a certain group of people is disturbing. I have never had to cut off clothing on non critical patients, and kids at a concert are probably not critical patients. Have you never gone through a phase as a teenager? This can be seen as willful distraction of property which is a crime. You have betrayed the trust given to you as an EMS provider to do only what is right for your patients. Looks like once again flashlights, badges, lights and sirens and uniforms have attracted the wrong type of people to EMS who bring the wrong attitude to the job. Wendy, plus one for a great post.

I really don't care about online popularity contests. The OP posted something on an internet forum where the public is free to reply and I posted my opinion. I can see that you think that destroying property when not nessecary is trivial. A 110 hour certain class or even a paramedic program does not give one the right to indiscrimatley use those shears in your pocket just because you find the way someone dresses silly. How could what you have written in response to my post been any less intelligent or debate provoking than the thumbs down emoticon you have in their? A "real winner"......

Your a real winner...........and to support wendy....please....

Incomplete training would result in public safety concerns. Concealing this is grossly negligent. PCP Instructors have an obligation to exhibit exemplary behaviour in order to preserve the integrity of the industry. Paramedics is an important and learned profession. As members of this profession, PCP Instructors are expected to exhibit the highest standards of honesty and integrity. PCP Instructors have a direct and vital impact on the quality of life for all people. Accordingly, the services provided by PCP Instructors require honesty, impartiality, fairness, and equity, and must be dedicated to the protection of the public health, safety, and welfare. PCP Instructors must perform under a standard of professional behaviour that requires adherence to the highest principles of ethical conduct. The Paramedic Academy owes a duty of care, and I believe has performed below this standard of care. Ordinary reasonable care is not the minimum for Paramedic Instructors. EMA Licencing and the Emergency and Health Services Act should have a process in place that requires PCP Instructors to report public safety issues immediately, and without undue delay. I am not convinced that the Act allows EMA Licencing to learn about these ignored public safety concerns. A process must be developed that would ensure these public safety issues are reported.