MemphisE34a

Does that mean I am not going to make the EMTcity christmas card list?

I can't speak for everywhere, but the places I have been fire based paramedics receive the highest pay, receive the most benefits, and have the best working conditions. For the 3rd or 4th time, if sitting in an ambulance at the 7-11 waiting on a call for $10 an hour or being staged at an ER where you perform other duties until there is a call is a progressive service, you can have it. If there were enough people that felt the same way you do, EMS would already be everything you aspire it to be. What kind of service do you think would be the absolute best? Private, government based? What kind do you work for?

And you have forgotten the value of good BASIC skills, without which you CANNOT be a good paramedic.

I don't. You put quite a spin on it. First of all, my panties are not in a wad and you speculate and twist my posts. I have told you I am not against EMS fire based or otherwise. I have told you that the paramedics under my command are happy and ASKED to be here. They are free to go anytime they feel mistreated. I am not holding any paramedics hostage. I agree with your jumping off the bridge approach, but my question is with SO many fire departments providing EMS is it really that bad? How many single function EMS departments have the exact same problems with the same kind of "sub par" employees you describe? Finally, falling into what trap? Have failed how? These are only your opinions. You cannot say that a seperate service here would offer any better medical care. You would more than likely end up with the same employees. I understand and respect your opinion that fire based EMS is not as good as a EMS only service, but thats all you have, your opinion. I will give you this - Ventmedic, DustDevil, yourself and others are obviously passionate about your opinions as they pertain to your job. That almost always means that you will perform well at it and normally better than those that lack that passion. At least we all care in our own way about our work place. After 13 pages, maybe we can all agree to disagree.

I have said alot through this thread, but I would challenge you to find quotes anywhere close to what you eluded to in the post above. As I have said all along, you don't know me, my department, or how we operate. You have run out of steam for your arguments and now resort to assumptions and personal attacks and claim to be the professional one, yet I don't have to apologize for anything. We are not the only one with fire based EMS you know. I guess everyone here and in New York, Chicago, Los Angeles, Houston, Dallas, Birmingham, St. Louis, Philadelphia, and nearly every other major fire department have it all wrong!!

No. Its not another piece of fire equipment put in service. Paramedics normally ride on an ALS piece or on an ambulance. If numbers are high - not normally - they can ride as a firefighter on a piece that is not normally ALS. Every piece we have is fully staffed everyday - 57 engines, 28 trucks, 3 heavy rescues, and 33 ambulances. As I said, you can't say which one they are first, they are capable of riding in either capacity but they are normally on an ambulance for at least 12 hours every day they are at work.

We have 300 paramedics, most of which are members of the IAFF. You think that their salaries and benefits are not negotiated through our local? What about all the other fire based EMS employees? You think that as a general rule they are paid more and have better benefits just because? As I have already stated, if sitting in ambulance at the local 7-11 waiting for your next call at $10 an hour is progression in the mobile emergency room pre-hospital based medical profession, some of you are much more delusional that I opriginally thought.

I respectfully degree. You exclude me from the EMS profession because you disagree with the manor in which it is implemented here, through the fire service. I have in fact been in the fire service for 20 years most of it as EMT and the last 3 or 4 as an EMT-IV - which I didn't have to get by the way, but because I wanted to be able to offer a higher level of service and be more able to help the paramedics I work with. I think I am entilted to an opinion even without this fact, you just don't agree with it so you would rather call it unimformed or ignorant. Every fire department I have been involved with a paid member or volunteer has also handled EMS emergency transport. This has ranged from a single station department to the one where I currently work now which has 57. If the police officer is an EMT, you should consider his opinion. But again, he is not in "your profession" so you yourself proclaim you would blow him off and also consider him unimformed and ignorant. And finally, I honestly don;t care how you feel of me, my department, or fire based EMS. If you review all of the posts, I only asked for the same in return. This entire thread and following conundrum is being debated mostly by people who have no idea and will never be affecteby anything the Memphis Fire Department does. I would also ask this: Name a larger organization than the IAFF that has done more for EMS employees as it pertains to salary or benefits. It all boils down to this:

I think I just figured this out..........are you dating Ventmedic? Once again you are wrong. Its not that I have no respect for EMS. I just don't buy into your Jr. Doctors running around in mobile emergency room theories. Hence the Mythbusters quote. You are actually a paramedic riding around in an ambulance. Not that there is anything wrong with that and it is not disrespectful, just a fact - which is why this ......................... is not being censored by the moderators.

Everyone is entiled to their opinion. You state yours much more compassionatly that quoting a Bill Engvall comedy line. There is nothing funny about this situation.

This reminds me of my favorite quote from Mythbusters: "I reject your reality and subsitutue it with my own."

I think pertaining to this we are both right. I whole heartedly understand your point. It is my point however that going on medical calls and car wrecks on a piece of fire apparatus IS part of the job of a firefighter. For that we are not paid anythign extra, it is as you pointed out already part of our negotiated salary. When a firefighter is detailed to work a shift on an amubulance he is paid extra. Point being that a firefighter with 20 years on the job who is not required to be an EMT is paid the same thing as a firefighter with 5 years on the job that is required to be an EMT. There is no salary adjustments for being an EMT in that regard.

Like I said, you make up want you want to believe. What I stated was that I can generally with a good level of accuracy call ALS or BLS from the house, which is why I am sure you haven't found the exact quote as you have so many times before.

Ha. Another one of you wonderful assumptions. I cover medical calls over about 1.5 square miles. The population consists of 99% poor, black people. The other 1% consists moslt of hispanics and the handful of white people that live in our territory who have been there so long they can't afford to move out. Therefore, I am not judging anyone by any of the demographics you describe, they are all equally poor, deprived, and challenged. Again, you read a newspaper article. I work here. I am aware of what the issues are. The problem here was hiring a "diverse" pool of paramedic applicants. I can assure you that none of the 3 paramedics assigned to me sent you anything. Even if they had, I would not retaliate against them or anyone else for having an opinion.

Where did I identify that as a problem? It is not, it is AWESOME!! Again however you read to much into or not enough of my posts. Paramedics are paid all of the time between Driver and Lieutenant pay regardless of what kind of equipment they are riding that day - fire or EMS. Firefighters who are EMT's are paid an additional hourly wage only for the hours that they are assigned to an ambulance. If you were not so ignorant about our department and new something more about it other than what you have read in a newspaper article or 4 year old study, you would know that incentives and a career ladder is in place - albeit I am not sure why you are interested in a career ladder as you are under the assumption that once you no longer ride an ambulance you lose all of your knowledge and are no longer capable of determining the difference between BLS, ALS, and BS calls. Additonally, we have had no problem recruiting paramedics over the last 2 years. There have been dozens apply from several states - the most popular being Ohio.

I personally don't have anything to gain or lose from my department delivering EMS. I have been here long enough that my job is secure either way, at least as it would pertain to that. As far as firefighter salaries go, they are negotiated for the work done as firefighters. We are not paid a dime for being EMT's except when these personnel are detailed to actually work on an ambulance and then they receive a higher hourly wage. In fact, because I know it would make you all feel so warm and fuzzy inside, an EMT is paid $.01 cent an hour less than paramedics while they are working on the unit. I guess that will make you anti-union as well. Also, FYI there was a period recently that non-essential city services like the ones you described above were cut back or eliminated in order to maintain fire, police, and EMS services.

See the post above.

Yes, I was kidding in a way. It is true that they didn't ride the ambulance however. I guess you don't understand how budgets work. When you only have 100%, spending 75% on EMS would only leave 25% for Fire Supression. Considering 90% of our budget is salaries, that would equate into an elimination in fire service. You are correct, ambulances do not need fire stations to be able to operate. Working 24 hour shifts though, I guess you could consider it a perk. At least for time you are actually there.

Maybe where you work. And just because they require a doctor does not need they need to be transported in an ambulance.

http://www.cityofmemphis.org/pdf_forms/assessmentOfEMSS.pdf I see your still making stuff up. I never made that statement. Yes, you pulled a study that is nearly 4 years old that outlined many problems with the EMS system at that time. You left out the part that the administration hired that nationally and highly regarded EMS professional that conducted the survey, made him a Deputy Chief of EMS who answers to only 2 people on the entire department, and told him to fix it! Since being hired, he divided the plans for improvement into 3 phases and has secured millions of dollars from the city council in order to implement the first two of them. I know its not the perfect plan, it could be a whole lot better if you were here to go on the 85% of the EMS calls that are pure BS.

LOL! Understood. Thanks.

From the original article: Absolutely agreed!

First of all, its funny that out of my entire post you only quote the part where I was obviously being sarcastic. Secondly, most of the stuff you are mentioning that I quoted above is being done, except some companies offer a higher level of service. There are 88 fire companies in the city. Of these, 34 are capable of being ALS, the other 54 are BLS. Fire companies are dispatched on a fairly accurate EMD system. Even though city wide EMS calls are like everywhere else, 75%-80% of the total call volume, my engine which is one of the busiest companies in the city maintains about a 50-50 ratio. We do not make every medical call in our area. The paramedic compliment has been dramatically increased over the last couple of years and more are being hired on a steady basis. Additionally, all new hires are required to become paramedics. Ambulances are dispatched on all working fires. Larger scenes will automatically get two: one to set up medical and one to be ready to transport. Last year, we bought 16 new fully stocked ambulances. There are currently 8 new fully stocked units at our shop waiting to be put in service. Our entire fleet is replaced about every 3 years. Can your service say that? Lastly, the Fire Administration has lobbied and convinced the city council to include placing a new ambulance in service every time a new fire station is built whether it be an additional station or one built to replace an existing one. Is it the very best plan? Probably not, but I think they have done pretty good do be a bunch of fireman who don't care about EMS........right?