Fire school?

[Richard B the EMT]

I have worked with female partners that can't lift the foot end of an empty cot. ... A lot of the girls I work with seem to have the attitude that they are female, weak and helpless. They can't lift as much as the guys, and shouldn't have to. ... Women can lift, they can do the job, but a lot of them just don't want to.

I have worked with such females, and actually told one to quit, as she was causing other employees to have back pains and injuries. I phrased it that she should pursue other elements of EMS than the field operations. I think she is a doctor now, but am unsure on that.

Also, I have male partners who cannot or will not lift, and, have had a few instances where the accusation was made against me, too.

[Eydawn]

If you can't lift the patient, don't try. You'll only hurt yourself and your partner. Not fair to anyone. This applies to males and females.

As to everyone out there who's indicated that women are, as a generalization, physically weaker than men and must take extra steps to achieve the same level of competence, you are absolutely spot on. There are some women who come to mind who could bench press some of you menfolk out there... but then there's women like me, average frame.

Do I have to work harder to lift the same amount? Yep. Do I have to use compensated lifting tecnhiques to make sure my joints are stable? Yup! Do I cop out and say I can't do it? Nope! Do I try to lift something I can't adequately lift? Nuh uh! I got one pair of knees to last me.. and don't plan on buying new ones.

Wendy

CO EMT-B

[fireflymedic]

I've been in EMS for a while and I've had good partners and bad partners both male and female some couldn't lift, some had horrible attitudes, and some were barely competent (and unfortunately they are still on the street). I myself am a female and have been through various PAT's for fire departments, some worse than others. I think many females ARE at a disadvantage for these tests simply because fire fighting is a profession which caters to the strengths of a male better than a female. HOWEVER that being said, I believe if you cannot meet the same standards which are set for the males, you should NOT BE IN THIS JOB ! The hose will not be any lighter, the person weigh any less, or the fire be any kinder just because you are a female. I can't stand females who think they are owed a less demanding test simply because they are women. The job is exactly the same for both, so shouldn't the test be?

[Yummymedic05]

One thing I could never understand about this CPAT (and please forgive me, I am not part of a fire department, nor do i ever in my lifetime have any intrest in it) is the fact that volunteers here, and some paid departments around this area don't require you take this test. These firefighters can do it for a fulltime career for 10+ years, and when they go to take this test for maybe a move to another department they can't pass it. So why is it they've done the job for so long, and done it well, worked out (all the ones I know that have failed are required to do some PT as part of being on the department), and all that other good stuff, yet still can't pass?

[akflightmedic]

One thing I could never understand about this CPAT (and please forgive me, I am not part of a fire department, nor do i ever in my lifetime have any intrest in it) is the fact that volunteers here, and some paid departments around this area don't require you take this test. These firefighters can do it for a fulltime career for 10+ years, and when they go to take this test for maybe a move to another department they can't pass it. So why is it they've done the job for so long, and done it well, worked out (all the ones I know that have failed are required to do some PT as part of being on the department), and all that other good stuff, yet still can't pass?

Well, here is my opinion.

First, the CPAT is not all about strength. I have seen women and very thin, small statured men pass with flying colors. I have also seen very "fit looking" guys fail miserably.

The test does have some strength componets to it, however it is all about the cardio and your endurance levels. I will now speak in broad generalizations but it is al based on my unscientific observations based on my many years in this field.

Most Americans do not do cardio. Firefighters in general do not do cardio. The guys I used to work with would look to be in shape, thye would go sling some iron and yes they were strong. However, their hearts were not. The number one killer of firefighters is cardiac arrest.

This is a huge, serious issue that has been addressed by the various Fire councils on a national level and all the trade magazines. People in general just do not take care of their hearts. It is easy to get complacent, especially after a few years on the job and thinking you are doing it well. Then you go to another department for a test and do horrible.

If you reflect on the job and how "well you did it" over the years, you will realize that the actual times you strained yourself was few and far between. Running 80-90 percent medical calls is not strenuous nor does it tax the body. Going on MVCs is not hard work and neither is operating the spreaders or cutters (jaws). Fighting actual fire just does not occur that often and by not training for it, they severly overwork themselves when that time does arrive. They end up functioning on pure adrenalin instead of physical conditioning. They push themselves beyond belief and do not realize it until afterwards.

Then there are the guys or departments where they have the luxury of sitting around in lazy boys all day doing minimal training (fire ground or physical). I do not need to elaborate on them anymore as it is obvious they will fail.

The CPAT is one of the best, most functional and practical entry tests I have ever seen or taken. It replicates actual work that may have to be done in the first 10 minutes of an actual attack on a fire. No part of the CPAT is irrelevant. This is why I feel it is very fair across the board for men and women. It is pass or fail, either you can or you cant. Very simple, no room or leeway for variance.