First responders L&S on POV insurance requirements

[spenac]

First responders L&S on POV insurance requirements. I bring up the subject because so many on here talk of responding to scene POV and also because so many paid and volunteer EMS people seem to install lights and sirens on POV's. Most regular insurance will not cover you if you crash running L&S. I know one volunteer service that pays $125 a month in insurance for it's director who often responds POV while they try and find someone for the ambulance.

If you respond POV have you notified your insurance? If you have L&S on your POV have you informed your insurance? If you have L&S did you know that you are still only asking for right away, that you must still drive with due diligence?

[Vicki Johnson]

I am not so sure what responding to a scene per private vehicle has to do with my question but I will try to answer your questions the best I can. Yes, many rural firefighters live in the county and respond to the scene per private vehicle. No, we do not use lights and sirens on our personal vehicles. When we respond we follow routine traffic rules, no acceptions! The way I understand it lights and sirens do not give you the right away even when we are responding in the rescue units or fire trucks. As far as insurance goes I have no idea if we are required to let them know that we are volunteers and occasonally respond to the scene per private vehicle. Ninety percent of Kansas firefighters are volunteer and it is not uncommon to have private vehicles responding to rural emergencies. I will follow up on the insurance thing though. By the way, are you a city boy?

[JPINFV]

The way I understand it lights and sirens do not give you the right away even when we are responding in the rescue units or fire trucks.

It's a convenient and useful misunderstanding. Technically speaking, L/S driving is a demand for the right of way, or else failing to yield to emergency vehicles wouldn't be a traffic violation. That said, the emergency vehicle operator is not relieved from driving with "due regard" for motor vehicles and pedestrians when engaged in emergency operations and in the end, physics doesn't care who had the right of way. Therefore, given the average level of maturity shown by EMS providers, calling it a request is beneficial, albeit incorrect.

[ccmedoc]

Although I do not nor have I ever responded anywhere POV. It is my understanding that if these individuals deem it necessary to light up their POV, they can register with the state and are officially an emergency vehicle when responding to an emergency. At least around here. All they need are stickers and lights and... POW, instant emergency vehicle. I also believe they need an additional insurance rider as such or are covered by their volly fire charter......As far as I have been told, this applies at least in this area of MI.

[spenac]

By the way, are you a city boy?

Nope. I'm at the end of no where way past middle of no where. 90 miles to nearest hospital. No air support.

Definitely check insurance if you are responding direct to scene POV.

[Chief1C]

Oh, they know. My insurance company bought my current light. Some dumb SOB cut the cord in two places and broke the lens somehow. The tried to remove it by dragging it across the roof, but couldn't pry the magnets loose. My vehicle courtesy light is registered w/ the state police and I have a permit for it somewhere. I believe that's a vehicle code requirement in Pennsylvania, however I doubt many follow it. I also have professional liability insurance specifically for Emergency Responders.

I feel that its a necessary safety device for parking along the road. However, I'm more apt to not use it while responding, b/c we know red lights make people stupid, and blue just confuses the hell out of them. I used to zip along w/ the light on, but nobody ever pulled over.. and I don't pass even in legal passing zones w/ the light on. I wouldn't want to appear to anyone that I was being wreckless while responding.

[NYAEMT-I]

In NY state in order to have Red Lights and sirens on your POV squadwise, you have to be an Emergency Ambulance Services Vehicle and have a state DOH sticker on your windshield. I have one and run L&S while responding to calls. I also live in a rural area where the nearest hospital is 45 minutes away. My insurance company is aware that I do so and have a rider in our policy that states that they cover us while using them. Also we are covered under our squads policy while responding too.

[Timmy]

Question, if there’s a need to have members respond in POV then why doesn’t the service provide there members with like a marked sedan that’s owned by the service and is insurance and equipped as an emergency vehicle?

[spenac]

Question, if there’s a need to have members respond in POV then why doesn’t the service provide there members with like a marked sedan that’s owned by the service and is insurance and equipped as an emergency vehicle?

Why pay when you get it for free. It goes back to the volly attitude, give it away for free. Sadly many don't check insurance and when they wreck while responding POV they are screwed as insurance company denys the claim and volly service leaves them swinging in the wind.

So my advice to those that continue to hurt my profession by giving it away for free is to get the proper insurance so you don't lose your home, etc for your hobby.

[medic_texas]

Another point to my argument that volunteer EMS needs to die. There is a need for volunteers but not as primary/first responding crews. I feel volunteers should be secondary to a primary crew in most areas. Some areas are too rural and small to have fulltime crews, and I'm ok with that. Studies should be done and towns with less than.. 500 people can have vollie only (that is just an example off of the top of my head, don't attack me).

Laws should mandate that if they are responding code-3 to a call they should have the required insurance coverage. This is just like NOT having insurance at all because if you are responding code-3 without the proper insurance, you are not covered. What's the difference? I don't see any....

Stop working for free.. my job isn't a hobby.. Good post Spenac.