Thanks Fire! For Screwing us over... yet agian.

[NREMT-Basic]

Go up to any firemedic...

Ask them to tell you their most exciting story from the job.

Will it be about the atypical MI they picked up on and offered the correct treatment to saving a life that another medic might have missed? Or will it be about that "totally awesome worker" a couple of years ago.

Whenever you make rash generalizations like "any firemedic" you instantly lose traction. You can say every, always, never, etc. You have to ask yourself what is the first goal of a firefighter AND and EMT....to prevent people from dying. Also, "firemedic" is a meaningless term. It is misleading in that it makes it sound as if a firefighter who is also a medic or EMT is going to be trying to prevent a fire from getting in the ceiling and trying to finesse a medical intervention at the same time. Firefighters are not taught emergency medicine in the same course where they are learning to knock down flames. They learn fire science and fire fighting and have either gone through an EMS program first, or have a year or so to achieve whatever level of certification their department or agency requires. A person can be a firefighter or a medic OR a firefighter AND a medic, but there is no such thing as "firemedic." That's a term coined by folks who have an axe to grind with those who can master more than one set of skills in a lifetime. Put the axe away, Brent. Its not cutting. And for the record, if, while functioning as a firefighter, I make a rescue and end up tubing a patient, I'm not going to be talking about the heat of the fire and new and nifty ways to use a halligan. Im going to be talking about the fact that I was able to take a patient without an airway and give them one.

[brentoli]

but there is no such thing as "firemedic." That's a term coined by folks who have an axe to grind with those who can master more than one set of skills in a lifetime.

655 IAC 1-2.1-89 Fire Medic I

Authority: IC 22-14-2-7

Affected: IC 22-14-2-7

Sec. 89. (a) This section comprises the minimum requirements for certification as a Fire Medic I.

( The candidate shall hold a current certification as an emergency medical first responder issued by the Indiana emergency

medical services commission pursuant to 836 IAC 1-10 [836 IAC 1-10 was repealed filed Jun 30, 2000, 4:18 p.m.: 23 IR 2759.].

© The candidate shall be certified as a Basic Firefighter, Firefighter I, Firefighter II, Second Class Firefighter, or First Class

Firefighter. (Board of Firefighting Personnel Standards and Education; 655 IAC 1-2.1-89; filed Sep 24, 1999, 10:02 a.m.: 23 IR 334;

readopted filed Dec 2, 2002, 12:59 p.m.: 26 IR 1262)

655 IAC 1-2.1-90 Fire Medic II

Authority: IC 22-14-2-7

Affected: IC 22-14-2-7

Sec. 90. (a) This section comprises the minimum requirements for certification as a Fire Medic II.

( The candidate shall hold a current certification as a basic emergency medical technician issued by the Indiana emergency

medical services commission pursuant to 836 IAC 1-5.

© The candidate shall be certified as a Basic Firefighter, Firefighter I, Firefighter II, Second Class Firefighter, or First Class

Firefighter. (Board of Firefighting Personnel Standards and Education; 655 IAC 1-2.1-90; filed Sep 24, 1999, 10:02 a.m.: 23 IR 335;

readopted filed Dec 2, 2002, 12:59 p.m.: 26 IR 1262)

655 IAC 1-2.1-91 Fire Medic III

Authority: IC 22-14-2-7

Affected: IC 22-14-2-7

Sec. 91. (a) This section comprises the minimum requirements for certification as a Fire Medic III.

( The candidate shall hold a current certification as an advanced emergency medical technician issued by the Indiana

emergency medical services commission pursuant to 836 IAC 1-9.1.

© The candidate shall be certified as a Firefighter I, Firefighter II, Second Class Firefighter, or First Class Firefighter. (Board

of Firefighting Personnel Standards and Education; 655 IAC 1-2.1-91; filed Sep 24, 1999, 10:02 a.m.: 23 IR 335; readopted filed

Dec 2, 2002, 12:59 p.m.: 26 IR 1262)

655 IAC 1-2.1-92 Fire Medic IV

Authority: IC 22-14-2-7

Affected: IC 22-14-2-7

Sec. 92. (a) This section comprises the minimum requirements for certification as a Fire Medic IV.

( The candidate shall hold a current certification as a paramedic issued by the Indiana emergency medical services

commission pursuant to 836 IAC 2-6.

© The candidate shall be certified as a Firefighter II or First Class Firefighter. (Board of Firefighting Personnel Standards

and Education; 655 IAC 1-2.1-92; filed Sep 24, 1999, 10:02 a.m.: 23 IR 335; readopted filed Dec 2, 2002, 12:59 p.m.: 26 IR 1262)

[akroeze]

Well played Brent, well played

[CaneMedic]

655 IAC 1-2.1-89 Fire Medic I

Authority: IC 22-14-2-7

Affected: IC 22-14-2-7

Sec. 89. (a) This section comprises the minimum requirements for certification as a Fire Medic I.

( The candidate shall hold a current certification as an emergency medical first responder issued by the Indiana emergency

medical services commission pursuant to 836 IAC 1-10 [836 IAC 1-10 was repealed filed Jun 30, 2000, 4:18 p.m.: 23 IR 2759.].

© The candidate shall be certified as a Basic Firefighter, Firefighter I, Firefighter II, Second Class Firefighter, or First Class

Firefighter. (Board of Firefighting Personnel Standards and Education; 655 IAC 1-2.1-89; filed Sep 24, 1999, 10:02 a.m.: 23 IR 334;

readopted filed Dec 2, 2002, 12:59 p.m.: 26 IR 1262)

655 IAC 1-2.1-90 Fire Medic II

Authority: IC 22-14-2-7

Affected: IC 22-14-2-7

Sec. 90. (a) This section comprises the minimum requirements for certification as a Fire Medic II.

( The candidate shall hold a current certification as a basic emergency medical technician issued by the Indiana emergency

medical services commission pursuant to 836 IAC 1-5.

© The candidate shall be certified as a Basic Firefighter, Firefighter I, Firefighter II, Second Class Firefighter, or First Class

Firefighter. (Board of Firefighting Personnel Standards and Education; 655 IAC 1-2.1-90; filed Sep 24, 1999, 10:02 a.m.: 23 IR 335;

readopted filed Dec 2, 2002, 12:59 p.m.: 26 IR 1262)

655 IAC 1-2.1-91 Fire Medic III

Authority: IC 22-14-2-7

Affected: IC 22-14-2-7

Sec. 91. (a) This section comprises the minimum requirements for certification as a Fire Medic III.

( The candidate shall hold a current certification as an advanced emergency medical technician issued by the Indiana

emergency medical services commission pursuant to 836 IAC 1-9.1.

© The candidate shall be certified as a Firefighter I, Firefighter II, Second Class Firefighter, or First Class Firefighter. (Board

of Firefighting Personnel Standards and Education; 655 IAC 1-2.1-91; filed Sep 24, 1999, 10:02 a.m.: 23 IR 335; readopted filed

Dec 2, 2002, 12:59 p.m.: 26 IR 1262)

655 IAC 1-2.1-92 Fire Medic IV

Authority: IC 22-14-2-7

Affected: IC 22-14-2-7

Sec. 92. (a) This section comprises the minimum requirements for certification as a Fire Medic IV.

( The candidate shall hold a current certification as a paramedic issued by the Indiana emergency medical services

commission pursuant to 836 IAC 2-6.

© The candidate shall be certified as a Firefighter II or First Class Firefighter. (Board of Firefighting Personnel Standards

and Education; 655 IAC 1-2.1-92; filed Sep 24, 1999, 10:02 a.m.: 23 IR 335; readopted filed Dec 2, 2002, 12:59 p.m.: 26 IR 1262)

How impressive :roll:

[brentoli]

Just saying, if an entire state recognizes them, it must not be THAT derogatory of a term.

[HellsBells]

HellsBells wrote:

Massive budget? What planet do you live on? The department I am training with recently got a referendum of 1 cent sales tax increase in their district for 3 months. First increase in budget in several years. Many of the FFs are still buying their own gear above and beyond what they are issued to be as prepared and effective as possible. I understand that certain EMS providers are threatened by fire based ems response, but is the constant slander and insult to firefighters really necessary. Shall we just close up shop and let EMS agencies learn how to use fire extinguishers so they can fight industrial and residential fires. With my department, you'll be happy to know, primary EMS was taken away from the fire fighters several years ago as was the department's sleeping quarters so that a private EMS agency could set up shop in the fire stations and then whine about having to get out of their recliners and put their clothes back on during sunday football games. As a result, there can be no duty fire crews because there is no place to quarter them which in turn slows down fire response.

I was referring more to the large municipal services. I know that here in Calgary, Ab. the fire budget is roughly three times what the ambulance receives. A lot of the call volume the FD use as stats for funding is based on their response to Delta calls, where fire is automatically dispatched with an ambulance.

[mrmeaner]

Just saying, if an entire state recognizes them, it must not be THAT derogatory of a term.

As well, some schools here have "firemedic" programs. I don't think the term is taken as derogatory here either.

[Lone Star]

I've had to revisit this topic several times and re-read from start to finish before I could post anything, just to 'cool down'....

I was a Firefighter for 15 years, with a department that was not a 'first responder department'. We did not do medical responses, because 1) the townships that I covered could not afford to provide such services, and 2) there were enough ambulance companies around the area (and the county medics from the Sheriff's Department) to provide that service.

After a few years of working with an 'on call/part paid' department, I decided to apply to a larger metropolitan area, (City of Warren, MI [suburb of Detroit])

One of the requirements to make the 'list' after passing the Civil Service Exam, and successfully negotiating the review board, was that I had to be at least an EMT-B.

I went to school, and found that it was something that I had the 'grit' to be able to do. (We can all agree that this job isn't for everyone)

Unfortunately, by not having the EMT-B license in hand when I met the review board, I wasn't high enough on the list to make the 'cut' for Warren FD.

The fact that the area I lived in was primarily an economic slave to General Motors (auto industry based economy), I decided to go into EMS as a way to put groceries on the table and a roof over my head.

Before I could test again, I suffered the presentation of a cerebral aneurysm, (the after effects pretty well disqualified me from passing the physical agility tests).

I stayed with the small fire department for another 10 years, until several 'regime changes' brought the right people into 'power' and they took advantage of a 'rough time' for me, and used it to axe me. (Believe it or not, my personnel jacket is clean)

It irks me to no end to see people constantly spouting how a person cannot master different skills and not be more than 'adequate' in either. I was a good firefighter, and I was also good as an EMT.

I've wanted to continue my education in not only fire, but in EMS as well, but doing things like working and recovering as much function as possible from that aneurysm kind of took precedence over any plans I've had.

For the original poster: If you think that the Fire Service just sits around and thinks of ways to stick it to EMS service, then rather sitting around bitching about it....do something to change it! Sniping posts on a private server aren't going to be 'productive' in changing anything!

I also have to extend 'kudos' to everyone that has posted thus far, I'm impressed that this didn't turn into a FD bashing thread!

My little 'sob story' here was to illustrate that a person CAN master more than one skill set and be more than 'adequate' at both.

I'm a Firefighter/EMT, (the order listed does not indicate a passion towards one over the other), and I happen to be damn good at both!

In my time in fire and EMS, I've seen 'fire based' EMS and I've also seen private EMS station out of the local fire station (completely separate areas for both)

In my opinion, both arrangements work well. If an EMT wants to learn fire fighting tactics....gung-ho! The same applies to Firefighters that want to learn EMS.

For those that are with a major municipal department that does both fire and EMS, if you can't bring yourself to do the aspects of both sides (whether for the glamour, or 'hero status'), then I think you need to remove yourself from that environment and focus on just one or the other.

Whether the better EMS provider is from a standing Fire Department, or private EMS sector...I can only say this: you'll have good providers in both areas, just as you'll have the ones that don't make the grade!

[NREMT-Basic]

As well, some schools here have "firemedic" programs. I don't think the term is taken as derogatory here either.

My apologies then. Its not a term that I had seen used in that way. You learn something new everyday. Thanks.

[NREMT-Basic]

Lone Star-

Bravo Zulu for your post. Its the most straightforward, no BS post on this topic that has been written in the thread.

Im a "yellow helmet" in training and so can understand your passion for doing both and I agree that one person can be good, even excellent at both. Today was the first day that we trainees were in full gear for a small live burn (dumpster full of pallet wood). We were just getting ready to start and the FTO came up to me and said he had a present. My department, do to political machinations of the last few years has a private EMS agency housed where the FFs used to be quartered and the FFs respond to the post from home. Since the private agency took over medical, most of our FFs got frustrated and let alot of their certifications slip so we have a department full of MFR's and a dozen or so EMT-Bs. In any case, the TO came up and slapped a SOL on my helmet I thought it was a very nice gesture and this man of 30 years experience let me know that he too believes one can be good at both.

Im glad you survived your illness and are working to get back at it. Im only sorry that the politicos which are to be found under the rugs over every department found way to show you the door when your jacket is clean. I know it sounds cliche, but thank you for your service, stay safe, keep your helmet on and your head down.

"Everybody Goes Home!"