LOL @ Pueblo, CO AMR/Fire Response WHY??????????????

[spenac]

OK so I just got back from Colorado. Saw Royal Gorge, 7 Falls, Garden of the Gods, etc. Did not get to climb Pikes peak due to weather.

OK here goes my complaint and question. In Pueblo, CO I was in a crowded public building. A person was feeling bad so the facility did call 911. I was on the way back to my van. All of a sudden I hear sirens keep changing of tones I guess to get traffic out of way. Then I realize there is another siren. I think well probably two 911 calls in my area. But no around the corner in the crowded parking lot comes AMR full speed L&S almost missing the facility person trying to wave them down. As if that wasn't bad enough the second siren is getting closer and here comes a large fire ladder truck blasting around the building in the crowded parking lot and it seemed to me almost hitting AMR ambulance, they actually had to back up. AMR crew is already walking cot into building. Several FF's jump out and run up to catch them. OK even though w/o other than a quick glance in my opinion patient was not in bad shape, no signs of distress, was actually smiling. At first I laughed but then I thought what if somebodys small child had been running in the parking lot there would have been no time for the ambulance driver or truck driver to have stopped. Then another thought crossed my mind, what a waste of taxi payer money rolling 2 pieces of equipment, think of cost of fuel, plus wear and tear.

OK enough. So some questions.

1. Even though they were probably responding to an unknown medical should they have been running so fast in a crowded area?

2. Is there any justification for dual response?

3. If justified would it be better for second response to come no L&S to minimize risks to public? Honestly no L&S in this case would have only had them arrive 3 or 4 minutes later and AMR could have stopped them if not needed or had them get equipment if needed.

4. Are we needlessly endangering the public?

I have many more questions/concerns but ................

One last question is this the norm in bigger citys?

I just cannot wrap my mind around such a waste of resources when at times we work with only one medic on the ambulance and end up with multiple serious patients on our one ambulance.

[jsadin]

I guarantee you they were running that fast because they were trying to beat each other to the scene (whomever gets there first cosistently can claim better response times). Sending a non-transport piece of fire apparatus to a medical call is wasteful and dangerous.

[firespec35]

Well the way I see it is this way. The 2 drivers driving like idiots is an issue unto itself. I work with festivals from 50,000-1,000,000 people in 1 area at one time. I do not "fly" I drive with due regard as do all my people. If I EVER see one of my people driving in a manner that I feel is dangerous I will pull them from the truck and make them part of one of our walking teams immediately. We will talk about their continued employment after the event. I may only be a 1st line supv but I know my boss will have my back on that one.

Ok on to the resources issue. First understand this I am a paramedic first and a firefighter second. They way the city of Detroit runs is Ambulance goes to medicals, fire trucks go to fires. The firefighters are not required to have anything beyond CPR/First aid about the only time they meet besides at the station is at PIA's. As for the suburbs most of the EMS is done by the FD's who usually send an engine too for manpower. If the FD does use a pvt company, they will usually send a Rescue/ Squad, or engine or both as a first response truck . Mostly I think it is protecting that cushy budget of thiers but sometimes the extra hands are nice. If it is a private agency transporting that may be coming from farther out I don't see a problem sending a Rescue/ Squad to get things started. If they are coming out of the same quarters and basically play follow the leader to the scene, thats not right especially if you have an EMD system that found out your patient is conscious alert and oriented and in not a whole lot of distress. I feel that there is a list of stuff that fire should respond to and the rest could be handled by the 2 people on the transporing unit.

As far as L&S- No cause if it was my way they never would have went to the call to begin with and if they are seperated then you want the FD apparatus to get there quickly to begin the BLS first response and they could slow down the ambulance if the patient is stable.

As far as endangering the public- Yeah we are, just as we endanger ourselves everytime we do this. But we train for it. What we need is a more refined EMD system that allows for more refined tiering of calls allowing us to slow down when we can

[DwayneEMTP]

First of all, spenac you chucklehead, when you went from Pueblo to the Royal Gorge you passed within about 300' of my front door! You missed a perfectly good opportunity to be able to claim, "There is such a thing as a free lunch!", as I would have been thrilled to treat!

Second...I did my my first phase field clinical in Pueblo and failed to see any professional behavior either from AMR or fire during that entire time. Lots of macho, 'rah rah' bs, a lot of competition between the two. AMR controls the scene and patient in Pueblo from the time they show up, but for some reason neither the ambulance, nor fire, will slow down the second unit after contact with the patient...I don't get it either.

And also, I'm guessing we all know that this has nothing to do with the "need" for a dual response. Fire here, as well as elsewhere, needs a way to justify it's existence so responds to medical calls. In my time there I failed to see any sign of professionalism from fire or AMR, as both seemed to be pissed to be interrupted by a call at any time of day or night.

Now, AMR and fire in the Springs was a completely different experience. Always safe, always professional, very much attention given to overcoming the issues between fire and the privates. Again though, 99% of the calls only needed an ambulance, the other 1% we were happy to have a lift assist...but alas, fire still needs something to do....

Dwayne

[spenac]

First of all, spenac you chucklehead, when you went from Pueblo to the Royal Gorge you passed within about 300' of my front door! You missed a perfectly good opportunity to be able to claim, "There is such a thing as a free lunch!", as I would have been thrilled to treat! Dwayne

I'll keep that in mind for next time, thanks. This time just wanted time with my family with no work or school related distractions. Was nice to forget it all for a while. Hey I even resisted helping people as others rushed to them such as this patient and even several wrecks. I guess if others would not have been there I would have stopped and dialed 911. :wink:

Well glad it was not just me in my bad impression of Pueblo AMR/Fire. Sad for the public though.

[DwayneEMTP]

I'll keep that in mind for next time, thanks. This time just wanted time with my family with no work or school related distractions. Was nice to forget it all for a while. Hey I even resisted helping people as others rushed to them such as this patient and even several wrecks. I guess if others would not have been there I would have stopped and dialed 911. :wink:

Well glad it was not just me in my bad impression of Pueblo AMR/Fire. Sad for the public though.

I got ya.

And yeah, you might want to add Pueblo to your list of places not to get sick or injured....

Dwayne

[JPINFV]

Sounds a lot like Orange County. My personal favorite is the triple response. FD engine or ladder truck, FD type 2 ALS ambulance, and private company ambulance (since the OC Fire Authority ambulance doesn't transport). The FD almost always responds code 3 with the private company normally responding code 2.

[CBEMT]

Other than everyone involved driving like morons, that's actually not bad. I know some places that send an engine, fire department paramedic squad, the commercial ambulance that actually does the transport, and sometimes the PD.

That said, the fatter this country gets, the less opposed to an engine company response I'm probably going to be...

[p3medic]

Your run of the mill cardiac arrest around here will get you a fire truck, either ladder or engine depending on the month, an ALS ambulance, a BLS ambulance, a cop and maybe an EMS supervisor.

[AnthonyM83]

Maybe they were trying to beat each other on-scene...