types of paramedic classes

[VentMedic]

Where are you folks getting your Physical Therapy from that it requires an MD or Ph.d? Certainly not in Massachusetts.

DPT and not M.D. This is national. The allied health professions test nationally by national standards and then apply to their state for licensure. This is their new mandate for standards in education which means there is a transition period. Just like all the other professions that have increased their educational standards (including Respiratory), there will be grandfathering and/or a grace period to complete the required course work.

For more information:

http://www.apta.org/

and MA also has its own chapter

I again say that I don't DISAGREE that we need more education, but to simply say "We need a degree" is simplistic. What we need is a reworking of the higher education system and for students to stand up and demand that the courses they take are relevant. As it is undergraduate progams in most colleges are nothing more than grades 13 to 16.

I am just puzzled as to how you could think that English and Math are a waste. I believe you are wanting more "certs" and "training" since you are still focused on the hours of training your paramedic program provided.

I truly did not see my undergraduate degree or graduate degree as "nothing more than grades 13 to 16". High school stops at 12. How could you have possibly spent anytime in a college and still come up with this perception of education?

Did you have a bad college experience?

I believe you are still confusing education and training.

Why do we have to rework the basic Associates degree to accomondate the Paramedic student? Do you believe the average paramedic student can not handle college course work and it must be simplified even more for them? Some college programs have already cut out college level A&P and have gone with the basic Body Structure and Function book which is also used in high school health science classes. How much more dumbed down do you want the paramedic degree if you don't want college level English, math and psychology?

Just because you don't want to advance your own professional status with a degree, or feel like it is useless for you, does not mean a whole profession should be held to your dumbed down view of education. You may have had a bad experience with college or barely made it through your classes. That doesn't mean everyone that seeks higher education will have the same experiences. Why did you even bother with a Bachelors degree? It seems you have no interest in education.

[jsadin]

Doug, I think your major hangup here is that you think people are saying "the degree makes the medic" as an absolute. I don't believe that is the case (at least not for me). For me, with something as serious as paramedic level medicine should be, a degreed individual is at least a basic first step towards putting everyone on the same educational playing field. If a paramedic is ever going to be viewed as anything more than a technician level provider simply following pre-planned scripts, there needs to be recognized educational standards applied to all. Can a non-degreed medic be a superb provider? Absolutely! Does it help our cause to be the ONLY medical providers with ZERO college requirements? Not one bit. Just take a look at the average medics salary and compare that to most degreed medical positions to see what I mean.

[calvair]

It is more than just time. It is very obvious that you are not a degreed paramedic, or if you are, you did it after the fact. All the classes in a Degree program help the paramedic.

Well you are right, I did get my AAS post Paramedic and the classes I took would have helped out incredibly with my Paramedic class. I am presently finishing my BAS in Public Safety Mgt and will be starting my masters (hopefully) in jan.

When I said that I didnt expect it to be blown out of proportion like it did. I believe that a majority of the classes you take to get your degree are needed but there are some really retarded requirements that you have to do sometimes to get your degree, and therefore doing your time to get that piece of paper

[JPINFV]

On a different note are there any other states that are doing that insta-medic program where you go from emt right into medic class even before you have your emt license? I hate that.....

Strange, insta-physician and insta-nurse programs don't seem to be a problem. Why should EMS do the odd thing and require work at a lower level? We honestly aren't that special.

[ccmedoc]

Strange, insta-physician and insta-nurse programs don't seem to be a problem. Why should EMS do the odd thing and require work at a lower level? We honestly aren't that special.

Whats to hate...JPINFV has it correct...

I still have not heard a valid argument for working as a basic EMT first...Straight to medic is the way to go...

[JPINFV]

Don't get me wrong, continued education is important, and should be incouraged, but it should be in a related field.

Instead of Psych 101 classes have a course on psych emergencies and how diffuse situations.

Instead of English Lit. how about a simple course in journal or observational writing.

Instead of a Phys. Ed. requirement (believe it or not bowling in my case) how about core strength and confined space rescue.

Instead of Art History or some other humanities course a course in cultural awareness including religion (I know this one will get peoples hackles up, but trust me I responded to a Diff Breather once with a knucklehead partner who failed to see the signs of a Jewish mourning and thought it was a party and actually asked where the birthday boy was...in case you didn't know covered mirrors is a big sign.)

So before I sign on to any call for a degreed program I would like to see the requirements would be.

We could always move paramedics to a 4 year degree. Afterall, my major (biological sciences) couldn't give a flying mouse's tail tip which courses I took to fulfill my breadth requirements as long as I did them.

[calvair]

ccmeddoc

"I still have not heard a valid argument for working as a basic EMT first...Straight to medic is the way to go..."

Is this coming from someone who went straight to medic without working as an EMT first?

[ccmedoc]

ccmeddoc

"I still have not heard a valid argument for working as a basic EMT first...Straight to medic is the way to go..."

Is this coming from someone who went straight to medic without working as an EMT first?

I'm curious as to what my working as a basic has to do with anything..

I still have not heard many intelligent arguments being made for the benefit of working as a basic before a paramedic. Certainly none compelling enough to justify it being mandatory... Rest assured it has been discussed here ad nauseum....I suggest a search on the subject..

Most of the AAS paramedic programs around here..that I am aware of..produce a graduate paramedic without very much time as a licensed basic..should they be mandated to work six months as an EMT? What would this accomplish? what is the benefit?

This is not to belittle basics..just tell be why working as a basic, or having to be a basic first is a benefit...... :wink:

[VentMedic]

At the very most, one should only work as an EMT-B long enough to finish the Paramedic program. If one was attending a college based program that would be about one year but one would also be still learning new things in the paramedic program while working. This would also give them access to instructors to mentor the educational process. Too often the EMT-B may stop learning, or have never really started, once they get out of class.

[Ridryder 911]

Maybe an alternative would be that the Basic Level would only be good for two years. After that it would expire or immediately be lowered to a MFR level; unless you were currently in a Paramedic program (good standing),

This would allow one to "work" in the field while obtaining experience, yet not procrastinate doing so and then increase our first responder ratio as common laymen for those that do not succeed or progress in the system.

The only exceptions allowed would be very remote areas and those associated with non-EMS as their primary functions.

R/r 911