first responders or emts

[Timmy]

I’m a firm believer that very service has there own job.

It’s quiet simple:

EMS provide prehospital care and transport.

Fire provide suppression and prevention.

Rescue provide rescue.

Police provide law and order.

All these services are unique and provide an entirely different service, they all have different outcomes and objectives.

[EMT*Sweet]

Ok folks, Before anyone leaps lets all apply our PPE - I'm adding a hardhat for good measure!! Now to push on with the psychological quizzing.

Wildfire, How much actual experience do you have with the FD? How many medical/trauma scenes have you been called to? Assuming you do have some experience since you asked the question- Please explain in your words why it is that you wouldnt want to be able to do more to help the patients, victims of fire or whatever the case may be.

Timmy, Please read what you wrote and consider other ways to percieve the means of the different departments and their roles where each are concerned and then find the common link. Do they really wind up with different outcomes and how vast is the differential area for objectives?

No Further!!

[Don1977]

I’m a firm believer that very service has there own job.

It’s quiet simple:

EMS provide prehospital care and transport.

Fire provide suppression and prevention.

Rescue provide rescue.

Police provide law and order.

All these services are unique and provide an entirely different service, they all have different outcomes and objectives.

I agree Timmy..

[BushyFromOz]

Timmy, Please read what you wrote and consider other ways to percieve the means of the different departments and their roles where each are concerned and then find the common link. Do they really wind up with different outcomes and how vast is the differential area for objectives?

Ummm yes, yes the do end up with different outcomes. With the exception of Fire doing rescue, there is very little that any of these have in common.

[Christopher.Collins]

Errrrr I dont know why Im even going to comment on this...

While I (and Im sure many others) do agree that we shouldnt have to be firefighters to do EMS and visa versca (for fairness)... thats just how it is.

Picture this... you roll up to an MVA (as EMS) but your service does not provide any form of extrication gear. This pretty much means all patient care, untill extrication is complete, will have to be performed by the FD. First Responders (at least in the State of Connecticut) can not place a c-collar on a patient... no EMTs in the FD? Well I guess that pt isnt getting a collar right away! Now what it that patient or another is critical but its going to be a long extrication? They may need fluids and more. The case of the month in JEMS a couple months back featured a young woman in an MVA (rollover on to its roof) with her arm pinned under it through the sun roof. Theres a little more than BLS involved there.

A few months back (also in JEMS) one of the regular columnists (Gary Ludwig of Memphis FD I believe) posted an article on FF's requiring medic certification to be hired. His major point in the article is a service requiring such cert and the perspective member not wanting to do this as part of their career. For example (this may not be accurate, just sake of example) if I wanted to join Memphis FD but had no interest in being a medic, Ill have to do it anyways if I really want a position there. This as Chief Ludwig goes on to explain, in concern, may lead too lack of commitment, poor judgment ect... in otherwords kind of half a**ing it because its not what you want. Not to mention its additional schooling after the academy, which takes away from personal and family time on top of work. Most people I know who want their medics are stressed enough balancing school, work family, etc. but imagine how one feels that dosnt want it?

I can understand why some people dont want to do EMS when they become fire, and others dont want fire to become EMS. Unfortunatley in most cases I feel it will never work that way, having a choice that is. If your dream is to work EMS at XYZ Fire Department because they have the best protocols, people, funding, etc... then expect to spend time at the academy and also work fire from time to time because alot of FDs may have you alternate Ambulance/Fire. If your not willing to do this then either go to FDNY (no offense guys, not intended as a stab) or work strictly EMS.

On the other hand if you want to be Joe Firefighter and just hump hose and climb ladders.... but want to work in a major city you may have to get your medic, probably EMT bare minimum. Not exactly sure why outside of my afore mentioned reason that there may be times where standalone EMS cant access a scene. Thats just how it is.

[JakeEMTP]

Picture this... you roll up to an MVA (as EMS) but your service does not provide any form of extrication gear. This pretty much means all patient care, untill extrication is complete, will have to be performed by the FD. First Responders (at least in the State of Connecticut) can not place a c-collar on a patient... no EMTs in the FD? Well I guess that pt isnt getting a collar right away! Now what it that patient or another is critical but its going to be a long extrication? They may need fluids and more.

Incorrect. We work with FD's regularly and we provide all patient care. My partner or myself will be in the vehicle providing pt. care if access is at all possible. If not, we'll start outside the vehicle. Point being, FD doesn't handle pt. care here, they fight fires and extrication as Timmy suggests. Not everywhere has adopted this policy of EMS based Fire suppression.

[letmesleep]

I also work for a strictly EMS district, but we work along side 3 different fire departments that have NO issues getting us in to a vehicle to start Pt care. We are all paid (EMS and FD), and all have our jobs to do out there. I will say that in St Louis co. that most FDs are joint services and do require medic.....notice I said MOST. On the other side of that last statement tho, the FDs in that co do pay much better for running fire and EMS.

[Christopher.Collins]

Eh, maybe Im just a stickler for safety. I have yet to jump into an MVA with no gear (minus the whole helmet on the roof thing)... but then again I havnt worked for an agency that dosnt provide gear either.

[letmesleep]

sorry chris, I was still waking up from a nap when I responded and missed the gear thing.....we have rescue gear, and helmets for any extrication

[CBEMT]

I need an EMT, with only a First Responder on the truck I can't use any ALS skills per DOH.

(FR in my state is not a recognized level of care. It is my department's designation for a CPR-trained member who is utilized as a driver.)