officers

[spenac]

I just can't believe this thread has lasted this long.

I second that.

[triemal04]

Out side of training officers, I really don't see the need to have officers in EMS.

Why? They don't need to be called by an officers rank per se, but the need for having some type of supervisor available each shift (and maybe more than one, and more than one level, depending on the size of the service) is neccasary. Unless you're part of a very small organization. VERY small.

Richard B did a good job allready, but even beyond larger incidents there is a need. If a patient or Joe Blow off the street has a problem with something one of the paramedics did, who handles that? If the ER has an issue, who do they go to? What happens when 2 partners really can't get along and create a real bad situation between the 2 of them(yeah, in a dream world it won't happen, but welcome to reality)? Who handles that? Who evaluates the paramedics performance on a yearly basis? If a problem occurs in the middle of the shift, who is responsible for handling that? And on and on and on.

And yes, there should be a process for being promoted, or whatever you want to call it (demoted for some that I know). Length of time in service...lack of problems...higher level of education....extra training...written test...oral tests...enough to ensure that the supervisor is of a good quality.

Course that doesn't always happen...hence why it's sometimes a demotion.

[JPINFV]

As I already said, mangers, QA, crew chiefs, etc. You don't need a 'captain' or other such nonsense on every unit. The last thing I want to deal with is some [insert random rank basic] talking out their rear and thinking that it matters that they are [insert rank]. Unless QA or supervision is your (generic "you") job or you're a higher medical level, care should be cooperative and not about ordering people about. I don't care what rank some basic is. If he/she/it is talking out their rear end, I have zero problem disregarding what is being said.

[FormerEMSLT297]

Col. Robert Gould Shaw of the 54th Mass. Reg? Wasn't that the character played by Mathew Broderick in the "War Between The States" movie, "Glory"?

I believe the correct term was "the war of Northern Aggression" LOL

[Just Plain Ruff]

I believe the correct term was "the war of Northern Aggression" LOL

But even though the south lost, they did get nascar.

[saboats]

As I already said, mangers, QA, crew chiefs, etc. You don't need a 'captain' or other such nonsense on every unit. The last thing I want to deal with is some [insert random rank basic] talking out their rear and thinking that it matters that they are [insert rank]. Unless QA or supervision is your (generic "you") job or you're a higher medical level, care should be cooperative and not about ordering people about. I don't care what rank some basic is. If he/she/it is talking out their rear end, I have zero problem disregarding what is being said.

Just to throw this out there, as it appears timely... This months JEMS has an article in it about EMS Chiefs, and (in the writer words) why they are valuable in many areas vs titles of Director, Operations Manager, President, ect.

Interesting read.....

JPINFV: If you location is correct, you work somewhere in the Boston Area, and unless that's for Boston EMS, means you work for on the many private forprofit services in the area...Doesn't matter which one, and I'm not disparaging anyone there, used to be there myself, but in those companies it seems that people are promoted via the buddy system, through attrition, or simple time in service - not through education, mentoring programs, testing ect... So if that's your experience I can totally see where you are coming from. But in the municipal industry, rank structure is important - expecially when divvying up tax payer money at budget time and competing with Fire and PD for the ever shrinking public safety funds....

[letmesleep]

In my district we have LTs (we are an EMS system only), but other districts around this areas (also only EMS) they have crew leaders. The county has also changed the Admin title to chief for political reasons I'm sure. Every system needs structure wether private or tax based. There has to a certain level of supervision to avoid "freelance EMS" from occurring. I will agree that the terms Capt and LT are not necessary, but no matter what they are called they are needed to maintain control of the district or company. I also believe that management classes and training should be required in order to promote. With that said, I still can't believe this thread has taken off, looks like spenac understood that the last time I said it!

[JPINFV]

JPINFV: If you location is correct, you work somewhere in the Boston Area, and unless that's for Boston EMS, means you work for on the many private forprofit services in the area...Doesn't matter which one, and I'm not disparaging anyone there, used to be there myself, but in those companies it seems that people are promoted via the buddy system, through attrition, or simple time in service - not through education, mentoring programs, testing ect... So if that's your experience I can totally see where you are coming from. But in the municipal industry, rank structure is important - expecially when divvying up tax payer money at budget time and competing with Fire and PD for the ever shrinking public safety funds....

I worked for 2 years in Southern California, but I haven't transfered my cert to Mass. yet because I was busy with grad school, but it sounds like most privates are the same the world around (good and the bad). So, short of as a way to 'justify' higher wages, who exactly is an officer going to lead on a crew of 2?

[letmesleep]

Good question, so let me add to my statement.....we have 4 trucks in service 24/7 which as you know adds up to 8 employees. Even with that number there can be any number of issues in the course of a shift.

[ERDoc]

But even though the south lost, they did get nascar.

And we are slowly taking that away too. :twisted: