tamaith Posted January 23, 2009 Posted January 23, 2009 spenec i agree that you can run with a bls crew while in school tons of ppl do that. but confused on this statement: What you will learn and do as a basic will not prove any real benefit and actually lead to you harming patients.
spenac Posted January 23, 2009 Posted January 23, 2009 spenec i agree that you can run with a bls crew while in school tons of ppl do that. but confused on this statement: What you will learn and do as a basic will not prove any real benefit and actually lead to you harming patients. so learning the basics is has no real benefit? lets say you never went to basic school and went right to medic school would you have known how to work a stretcher, give an oral report and feel comfortable doing it? apply o2 and how much etc? and how can I as a basic harm a pt. if i follow local prtocol? i do understand that some basics get lazy since 90 percent of the time all we / I do is transport to and from dialysis. but if you don't let yourself get that way you wont harm the pt. Also i agree that the more knowledge you have is always better i also believe don't let school get in the way of education. Am i missing something? you are 100 percent entitled to your opinion as am i . i just like to know how others think and why they think a certain way thats all. You learn all the basics in Paramedic as well. Honestly do away with basic and require everyone to get educated before they go out and touch people. That would be the perfect solution. I could have learned everything in medic school that I learned in basic.
JPINFV Posted January 23, 2009 Posted January 23, 2009 so learning the basics is has no real benefit? lets say you never went to basic school and went right to medic school would you have known how to work a stretcher, give an oral report and feel comfortable doing it? apply o2 and how much etc? and how can I as a basic harm a pt. if i follow local prtocol? My God, how do all those physicians who never practiced as a PA or RNs who never worked as a CNA ever learn how to give report or about oxygen? As to the stretcher, if it takes you longer than a few patients during your medic internship to learn how to operate it (honestly, there's what, 4 levers? 1 elevating/lowering the head, one for elevating/lowering the feet, and 2 for the undercarriage [1 on the side, 1 by the feet]). After all, what if your basic company used Strykers and your internship company used Fernos? Alternatively electronic v manual? It's not rocket science.
tamaith Posted January 24, 2009 Posted January 24, 2009 i was under the impression that in medic school they don't go over anything you've learned in basic school. so what the first couple of days is a review or something? and jpifnv if you go back to what was said by spenec " learning the basics has no real benifit " and go to what you said learning how to use a stretcher should take no more than 4 pt.s aren't you learning the basics if physicians and rn's know how to give an oral report or use o2 thats because the learned the basics or were they born with that knowledge. im still confused on how i can hurt the pt if i follow protocol. i think if you don't know the basics yes you can hurt the pt. the person who had the question in the beging is going to do what they feel like regardless of what anyone on here says they should trust their gut. and what about tuition? some places charge 10,000 or 25000 depending on where you are? as said before yes you can work while in school but the ones i know that work while in school can only work maybe 2 days the rest of the time they are studing or doing clincal. you cant survive by just working 2 days/ wk. loans? what if you get denied? or just don't want a loan? again this is just how i feel my OPINION . i rather work in the field for a year make sure this is what i want to do for the rest of my life than pay 25,000 and then decide i hate this type of work.
spenac Posted January 24, 2009 Posted January 24, 2009 i was under the impression that in medic school they don't go over anything you've learned in basic school. so what the first couple of days is a review or something? and jpifnv if you go back to what was said by spenec " learning the basics has no real benifit " and go to what you said learning how to use a stretcher should take no more than 4 pt.s aren't you learning the basics if physicians and rn's know how to give an oral report or use o2 thats because the learned the basics or were they born with that knowledge. im still confused on how i can hurt the pt if i follow protocol. i think if you don't know the basics yes you can hurt the pt. the person who had the question in the beging is going to do what they feel like regardless of what anyone on here says they should trust their gut. and what about tuition? some places charge 10,000 or 25000 depending on where you are? as said before yes you can work while in school but the ones i know that work while in school can only work maybe 2 days the rest of the time they are studing or doing clincal. you cant survive by just working 2 days/ wk. loans? what if you get denied? or just don't want a loan? again this is just how i feel my OPINION . i rather work in the field for a year make sure this is what i want to do for the rest of my life than pay 25,000 and then decide i hate this type of work. I did not say not learning the basics. If it came accross that way sorry. The basic class and experience I gained in many years could have been more benefited by getting real education including the basics then getting my experience as a medic. No other medical field expects their people to start at a low level, they all go straight through with education. Then they get field time with experienced people. Then they go out as full fledged Doctors, RN's, etc. Perhaps you can get a basic surgical cert and use the rib spreaders for a year before you decide to go on to medical school. :roll:
tamaith Posted January 24, 2009 Posted January 24, 2009 it is what you said and thats how it came across but no sense of arguing to me its water under the bridge. if i did get a surgical cert for basic rib spreading i d prob make more money than i do now. :roll:
spenac Posted January 24, 2009 Posted January 24, 2009 it is what you said and thats how it came across but no sense of arguing to me its water under the bridge. if i did get a surgical cert for basic rib spreading i d prob make more money than i do now. :roll: Actually after rereading I never made the comment. here is all my comments. No where did I say we did not need to learn basics. I said as below. "You learn all the basics in Paramedic as well. Honestly do away with basic and require everyone to get educated before they go out and touch people. That would be the perfect solution. I could have learned everything in medic school that I learned in basic." "Any good paramedic program will require plenty of clinical time. Yes I agree many diploma mills lack enough clinicals to even get any true exposure. But this person seems to want quality. Plus honestly as a basic you can get ambulance time while in your paramedic program. Why are we supposed to be different than other medical professionals, get the education, then get the experience." "Get straight into Paramedic school. There is no benefit to waiting. You can run as a basic while in the Paramedic program though that is not even necessary. What you will learn and do as a basic will not prove any real benefit and actually lead to you harming patients." All my comments seem very clear that I feel that there is no point to be a basic, that you can learn the basics as a medic. Sorry you must have confused my statements so how.
tamaith Posted January 24, 2009 Posted January 24, 2009 What you will learn and do as a basic will not prove any real benefit and actually lead to you harming patients." so you didn't say what you learn as a basic will not prove any real benefit? i got the above from your statement. and you still have not explained how i as an emt b can harm a pt. unless of course i drop them
JPINFV Posted January 24, 2009 Posted January 24, 2009 and jpifnv if you go back to what was said by spenec " learning the basics has no real benifit " and go to what you said learning how to use a stretcher should take no more than 4 pt.s aren't you learning the basics if physicians and rn's know how to give an oral report or use o2 thats because the learned the basics or were they born with that knowledge. They learned about oxygen and reports in medical and nursing school respectively. Not by working as a [insert other medical/health care/allied health provider] first. im still confused on how i can hurt the pt if i follow protocol. i think if you don't know the basics yes you can hurt the pt. You don't know the basics if you don't have a good understanding of A/P (hint: that 2 hours of A/P called "The Human Body" in EMT-B class does not give you a good understanding). Furthermore, anyone who thinks that a single set of protocols can provide optimal treatment for all patients is dangerous. the person who had the question in the beging is going to do what they feel like regardless of what anyone on here says they should trust their gut. and what about tuition? some places charge 10,000 or 25000 depending on where you are? as said before yes you can work while in school but the ones i know that work while in school can only work maybe 2 days the rest of the time they are studing or doing clincal. you cant survive by just working 2 days/ wk. loans? what if you get denied? or just don't want a loan? My graduate school cost 40k for last year in tuition alone and left zero time to work (well, if you wanted to pass). Take out some loans and, unless you have a crap credit rating (hint: don't charge what you can't pay), you probably won't be denied. again this is just how i feel my OPINION . So what? Welcome to a discussion board. We discuss things. No, not everyone can or will be right and stating that something is your opinion will not magically make people agree with you. i rather work in the field for a year make sure this is what i want to do for the rest of my life than pay 25,000 and then decide i hate this type of work. That is certainly your option, but don't go around thinking that a year doing dialysis transports or discharges, or even running 911 with your only post secondary education being a 110 hour EMT-B course is going to give you some magic insight to prehospital care.
JPINFV Posted January 24, 2009 Posted January 24, 2009 What you will learn and do as a basic will not prove any real benefit and actually lead to you harming patients." so you didn't say what you learn as a basic will not prove any real benefit? i got the above from your statement. and you still have not explained how i as an emt b can harm a pt. unless of course i drop them How about this one. It's easier to teach someone with a blank slate than trying to break bad habits.
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