Monkeys and EMS

[Dustdevil]

They don't know why..they just don't want the other monkeys to smack 'em around..

Sig-worthy!

[emtannie]

I can appreciate the analogy, and yes, far too many EMTs, medics, and firefighters fall into the “we have always done it that way” category.

What bothers me about the referring of others as “monkeys” is – what are we doing to change that analogy? It is easy to stand back and say “what a bunch of monkeys” but far more difficult to change the status quo.

Education is lacking in all areas… a large part of the problem, which was posted by several people in another thread which was recently locked, is the lack of education of EMT-B’s and EMT-I’s, and medics as well… I think some would agree that we could probably teach a monkey to apply O2, and even start an IV or intubate….. but I hope that the difference between EMS and monkeys is that before performing that application of O2, starting that IV, or intubating, we can explain WHY we are doing it. I know, I know, we aren't there YET..

To those that are able to stand back and observe the monkeys…. Please don’t just stand there and admire their … (ok, I was going to say ‘coconuts’ or ‘bananas’, but that will probably turn this thread in a whole new direction…so I will let you choose the reference you prefer...) Anyways…. I hope that rather than watching the monkeys, we can teach them, and they can learn… and then we can refer to previous generations of EMS and fire as the monkeys and not our present generation.

Good analogy, but one I hope will go the way of the dinosaur.

[Mateo_1387]

You honestly do not believe that a valid analogy exists between the above scientific observation and many of the things we do as EMS providers?

Sooo....I guess, indirectly, what we do in EMS is backed up by this scientific observation. Were making progress by using science !!

JK folks

And Dust, thanks for clearing up the term related to all this monkey business !

[Arizonaffcep]

The one thing that separates human kind from animals? Fear of vacuum cleaners!

Honestly, a lot of what we do could be considered "monkey skills." IV, Intubation, 12 lead etc. The real ART of the profession lies in 1. assessment skill and the ability to translate what is seen/found to a plan of action, and 2. bedside manner, because, as the patient, typically I don't have enough knowledge to know if you (the practitioner) have "mad skills," but I can tell if you were rude/condescending or not. This is PRIMARILY where the patient's opinion of the practitioner/service/EMS in general will stem from.

[Dustdevil]

...as the patient, typically I don't have enough knowledge to know if you (the practitioner) have "mad skills," but I can tell if you were rude/condescending or not. This is PRIMARILY where the patient's opinion of the practitioner/service/EMS in general will stem from.

Sweet! :thumbright:

This is the all too often overlooked aspect of the education of medical professionals. And it is why I would never let anyone into my programme until they had successfully completed two semesters of psychology, a semester of sociology, and an interpersonal communications course. Our business is human beings. Communicating with them effectively and therapeutically is the first step in caring for them. If you fail that step, you are nothing but a monkey.

[AnthonyM83]

Cage = EMS?

String = Certain options available under the current system?

Banana = Reward for behaviors that some providers would begrudge other providers?

Cold shower & beating monkeys = Posting flames?

Admittedly, these are just wild guesses. :wink:

I didn't go that far into analyzing it, but took it as those in EMS doing things just because that's what they were trained to do, never questioning why they do things. AKA a reference to cookbook medicine and state of EMS

[bigj1130]

This just shows why we do NOT need those medic mills to crank out 200+ medics in a year. These mills can get you to the test, and that is about it, While I discussed this in another thread a liitle bit, I think to avoid the monkeys in the cage thing that we have is for LESS PARAMEDICS with a bigger skill set and knowledge base in this great country of ours, and throughout the world. If we are to be professionals then we have to act like it and know why we do what we do. The Cardiologist knows what he is looking for in a 12 lead ECG that can mimic STEMI or hide STEMI, but do most medics? In some parts of the country I will say no. To me that is a problem, especially when some systems allow the medic to start their patients path to the cath lab. I hope that my generation (under 30 still got a lot of years left to pension) can do something to put a stop to this Monkey Business that in the end is only hurting our customers. Ok I am done ranting, I will slowly look away from that beautiful banana and try go try to find a way to not get assaulted by 4 monkeys I have never met before.

[zippyRN]

it's not just EMS , other parts of healthcare can be as bad, even with (supposedly) educated people in them ...

a recent discussion elsewhere about people remaining on Long Extrication Boards once they had arrvied i nthe emergency department descended into a flame fest with accusations that that people posting the none USAn dogmatic answer (even though it;s backed up by National clinical guidelines from elsewhere in the world and they have a decent evidence base) were 'dangerous', incompetent , substance abusers or mentally ill ... while thosewho espoused the USAn dogmatic veiw were 'safe' and competenent despite the fact their practice is proven to cause iatrogenic harm

[chbare]

Hehe, thought so. Not everybody was supporting leaving people on the board.

Take care,

chbare.

[zippyRN]

Hehe, thought so. Not everybody was supporting leaving people on the board.

Take care,

chbare.

true, but plenty of people suggestign the dogma was 'gold standard' and showing a complete lack of grip on anything other than following Doctor's orders ...