Helicopter EMS Question for providers outside the USA

[emtannie]

Yes except we have 5 and an AW139

He was talking night landings..... and don't get me started on the politics of the organization you speak so highly of iMac.....

Rotary flights here are daytime only.

[Arctickat]

I'm a pilot, although not rotary wing, I do have some insight. This http://www.tc.gc.ca/CivilAviation/commerce...39/section9.htm is the Transport Canada Guide to Air Ambulance Operations for helicopters. I will see what else I can find, I'm looking through the CARs for more information. Waht i do know is that they must still follow the weather minima for VFR flight. At night, that can be difficult.

[iMac]

He was talking night landings..... and don't get me started on the politics of the organization you speak so highly of iMac.....

Rotary flights here are daytime only.

I said nothing highly about it my dear, with time things change darling.

[tniuqs]

The helicopter is just a mode of travel .... like a broomstick for a witch, point being that rotary are limited to VFR in the majority of cases, icing conditions, +++ .... but since we are on the topic what does annoy me is STARS smoke and mirrors in marketing with this operation has done to convince the public that it is the only show, typically IMac continues to promote shamlessly without consideration for the other fine operations, and mostly based out of ignorance. The arrogance to believe that at the sweep of a broom another Helicopter Company could step in .... YES Really, its happening with ground ambulance IMac!

And since when did STARS use EMTs on board to start with anyways?

WE HAVE 5 ? huh ?

We know your rank IMac, But hey STARS carry great teams typically Paramedic and RN, (some close personal friends) sometimes specialty teams, again its a means of transporting a Team to the patient ONLY.

Patient familys certianly are not impressed when the flying blood clot does land in THEIR front yard ... hey maybe every farmer in the province need a STARS registry site like every industrial site has in the province with a false promise ..... tell me it isnt so, try explaining that to the next family in rural Alberta when they have a Calander on their fridge ... it just generates animosity with the rural EMS providers.

The real truth is STARS has only 2 Alta Health sanctioned "Bases" they run out of GP without even a chopper pad @ the QE2 Hospital and then ground them into hospital from the airport, about 20 minutes, the prior GPREMS used Canadian Helicopters for 15 years and did a wonderful job.

Peregrine helos works in Hinton a 206 Longranger.

Phoenix helos in Ft. MacMurray operates a Twinstar.

Delta is used out of High Level, last I heard.

Yellowhead Helos is the "REAL" rescue Helo in Jasper and Banff ... Parks Canada wants to use STARS for target practice and they do have a 105 mm recoilless ... I know I used to fire it !

There is a helo out of Lethbridge, can't remeber who operates it.

So sure use a rotary when you need one, assess the risk factors and possible delays but fixed wing in this "hood" is usually twice as fast to the patient in a range of over 200 knots .... want the math, no worries I have done it over and over.

And over my dead body will STARS get anywhere near a ASRD fire (CARs controlled Airspace) when I have a minimum of 4 medium lift birds, like what would be the point of that ... bring a bird in from hundreds of miles away .... because its Red and operates as a so called non-profit organzation ? sheesh.

Looking forward to Arctikat .... research on the real regs ... honestly this is why there are so many crashes in the US ... its a competition for buisness ONLY, and Bledsoe agrees, I did chat with him on this very subject hes of the opinion that the old experianced Vietnam Pilots are now all retiring and low time pilots with attitude are a huge issue, mission informed vs non informed a factor too.

But Once again IMac is promoting something she really knows nothing, embarassing the rest of us that also proudly represent the Canadian Flag, the snotty comment's about "change" is typical of IMac.

So this year at Christmas (or any time of the year) when you want to donate any money to a honest non-profit operation, think Salvation Army, think United Way, think Catholic Family services ... they need those limited funds more than a slick calander salesperson at the door telling you that STARS SAVES Lives, its the whole team "from start first responder all the way to discharge from hospital ... THATS the TEAM that saves LIVES the ENTIRE TEAM.

BTW the calander is not recyclable.

cheers

ps STARS got booted out of NS back in the day ... good for NS I say, Ontario and NS governments pay for those birds ... not door knockers like vacume sales folks or begging for handouts from the oil industry ... apologies in advance to the vacume salespersons.

[mobey]

Well.... squint said everything I wanted too, but I will add this.

I was told by our town mngr how much this community donates to STARS annually. The amount donated is enough to top up my wage to a Paramedic, but instead we give it away to the "life savers" and when I finish school I am out of a job, and this service stays BLS.

Hmmmm, wonder how many patients would benefit from this being an ALS service vs the 6-8/year that ride in STARS.

Side note: Out of the 6 people whom we sent flying in 2008, only 1 actually went straight to surgery for internal bleeding, 1 went to ICU for chest injuries and the other 4 were discharged the same or next day!

However, every single patient that was in pain when we picked them up stayed in pain, all our codes stayed dead, etc, etc.

[iMac]

The helicopter is just a mode of travel .... like a broomstick for a witch, point being that rotary are limited to VFR in the majority of cases, icing conditions, +++ .... but since we are on the topic what does annoy me is STARS smoke and mirrors in marketing with this operation has done to convince the public that it is the only show, typically IMac continues to promote shamlessly without consideration for the other fine operations, and mostly based out of ignorance. The arrogance to believe that at the sweep of a broom another Helicopter Company could step in .... YES Really, its happening with ground ambulance IMac!

And since when did STARS use EMTs on board to start with anyways?

We know your rank IMac, But hey STARS carry great teams typically Paramedic and RN, (some close personal friends) sometimes specialty teams, again its a means of transporting a Team to the patient ONLY.

Patient familys certianly are not impressed when the flying blood clot does land in THEIR front yard ... hey maybe every farmer in the province need a STARS registry site like every industrial site has in the province with a false promise ..... tell me it isnt so, try explaining that to the next family in rural Alberta when they have a Calander on their fridge ... it just generates animosity with the rural EMS providers.

The real truth is STARS has only 2 Alta Health sanctioned "Bases" they run out of GP without even a chopper pad @ the QE2 Hospital and then ground them into hospital from the airport, about 20 minutes, the prior GPREMS used Canadian Helicopters for 15 years and did a wonderful job.

Peregrine helos works in Hinton a 206 Longranger.

Phoenix helos in Ft. MacMurray operates a Twinstar.

Delta is used out of High Level, last I heard.

Yellowhead Helos is the "REAL" rescue Helo in Jasper and Banff ... Parks Canada wants to use STARS for target practice and they do have a 105 mm recoilless ... I know I used to fire it !

There is a helo out of Lethbridge, can't remeber who operates it.

So sure use a rotary when you need one, assess the risk factors and possible delays but fixed wing in this "hood" is usually twice as fast to the patient in a range of over 200 knots .... want the math, no worries I have done it over and over.

And over my dead body will STARS get anywhere near a ASRD fire (CARs controlled Airspace) when I have a minimum of 4 medium lift birds, like what would be the point of that ... bring a bird in from hundreds of miles away .... because its Red and operates as a so called non-profit organzation ? sheesh.

Looking forward to Arctikat .... research on the real regs ... honestly this is why there are so many crashes in the US ... its a competition for buisness ONLY, and Bledsoe agrees, I did chat with him on this very subject hes of the opinion that the old experianced Vietnam Pilots are now all retiring and low time pilots with attitude are a huge issue, mission informed vs non informed a factor too.

But Once again IMac is promoting something she really knows nothing, embarassing the rest of us that also proudly represent the Canadian Flag, the snotty comment's about "change" is typical of IMac.

So this year at Christmas (or any time of the year) when you want to donate any money to a honest non-profit operation, think Salvation Army, think United Way, think Catholic Family services ... they need those limited funds more than a slick calander salesperson at the door telling you that STARS SAVES Lives, its the whole team "from start first responder all the way to discharge from hospital ... THATS the TEAM that saves LIVES the ENTIRE TEAM.

BTW the calander is not recyclable.

cheers

ps STARS got booted out of NS back in the day ... good for NS I say, Ontario and NS governments pay for those birds ... not door knockers like vacume sales folks or begging for handouts from the oil industry ... apologies in advance to the vacume salespersons.

LOL a good post squinters, good post. That ended my night with a smile; and by the way they were requested by the med evac company in NS to come and rebuild their operation after which they were indeed booted by that same company that requested them in the first place.

I hope you sleep well tonight darling, I'll be thinking of you :wink:

[WolfmanHarris]

Could a poor ignorant Ontarian get sent a link or be brought into the fold on this one? There's not enough context so far for me to piece together exactly how it works in Alberta and what the problem is.

As far as ORNGE goes, it looks like Canadian Helicopter Ltd is on its way out long term. ORNGE has bought their own choppers and is now only buying staff for flying and maintenance from CHL. And the scuttlebutt I've heard is that when that contract is up in 5 yrs Ornge will take that in house too.

[tniuqs]

Mobey ... exactly the point in fact !

I dare say that Bledsoe would agree with you as well, many needless trips by helo when fixed wing is by far a lower risk assessment to all, besides, I bet in your area you can make quite a few kms in the same time that a central dispatched Helo just to lift off and respond.

I am hopeful, but wary of any government moves in the new (improved ground system proposed) in that regard, that being upgrading more rural services to the ALS level. The current funding "municipal formula" STARS in fact takes vital cash strapped rural operators of the ground revinue .... fingers are crossed that a newer better model for delivery of services for all in our hood.

Sorry to the OP and stray off topic a tad ... I suspect its the same situation in many places in the US.

cheers

[tniuqs]

So, in Canada, what are "designated helispots" ??? Are they lighted pads at the rear of Police and Fire Stations ???... Are they big wide open pads adjacent to highways, every so many miles,,, are they Hospital helipads ???....

I'm curious what the "official" helipad designation means...

Also ,, so you have a really bad wreck shooting, whatever at night,,,, and the ER is like 1 hour by ground,, do you:

A) go to to local ER and stabilize, ???? and then transport by ground, or air?

or

Go direct to the Trauma center from the scene ????

To answer your query, an approved "MOT" ministry of Transport has many criteria as you have pointed out I suspect more strict in Canada.

Logistics for querys A and B ... to put it into perspective in an area as large as Alberta ... google it, we have I believe only about 8 Real Trauma centers most centrally located.

hope that helps.

[Kiwiology]

Pilot's discretion here from what I understand.