Lights and sirens

[little green yoda]

ok in the uk we are bless cos we dont use em on all calls if it aint life thretening its coded green and has a non emergency 30 min responce time, although apon info if we feel as clinitians that the call warrents blues n twos then thats what happens,

mind you i like the game of using blue lights but trying not to use the two tones from roadside/station to the call and to the hosp, thats always a challenge

i think im my opinion it dont really need to be used on nights whens there is no cars or pedestrians about and you have a clear path,

unless your like me and adopt the opinion of if im awake so should everybody else be

even during the day whats the point if there is nothing about to warn, its the same as using a indicator why do it if there is no one about the signal to?

all this is down to drivers descretion, but do realise if you hit anything while on a call you will be at fault if trying to claim exemption under the emergency driving laws by not driving with emergency procedures

as for the above person who mentioned we do fake calls for practice? how odd neevr in a million years.. 1 would never get time and 2 it would be far to dangerous

[WolfmanHarris]

Don't believe the "studies".

Lights and siren allow MUCH time to be saved.

What is this based on? Anecdotal evidence is quite possibly EMS' biggest enemy. Since we've all seen something work, or make a difference we are awful for refusing to accept evidence contrary to this.

That being said, I've been keeping an eye out for a study on response times with L&S is rural areas. Where I'm consolidating at the moment is very rural with single lane roads. People in this area are very good at moving to the right. I've done some back of the envelope calculations on some of our responses and have found that when we proceed L&S (allowing us to travel 100km/h in an otherwise 80km/hr zone) with everyone moving to the right I've noted ~20-25 savings in response times, which equals about five minutes for our average rural response versus responding non L&S.

Is this time clinically significant? I highly doubt it. About the only consistent benefit I've come up with is that without L&S our ability to meet the window for the regional stroke centre or STEMI bypass might not be met as often. That and we keep beating the VFD to all these calls they're tiered on, which should make it easier to claw back the tiered response agreement so that we don't have them "first responding" to all these calls.

But remember this is one station in a county, in an entire region of the province. My one unit's experience can't dictate best practice for a profession.

[Richard B the EMT]

As for "If I have to be up, everybody has to be up"?

Early on in my career, my dispatcher reported that, as we responded to a call at 0230 hours, some lady called up to complain about the ambulance using the siren (a Federal "Q", which is a loud one), at that hour, and awakening herself and 10 year old grandson. Her attitude was, "there's nobody on the road at that hour, so no need for any noise".

As to the call type, the dispatcher asked her, "If nobody is on the road, why are we going to a multiple car crash?"

[tskstorm]

As for "If I have to be up, everybody has to be up"?

Early on in my career, my dispatcher reported that, as we responded to a call at 0230 hours, some lady called up to complain about the ambulance using the siren (a Federal "Q", which is a loud one), at that hour, and awakening herself and 10 year old grandson. Her attitude was, "there's nobody on the road at that hour, so no need for any noise".

As to the call type, the dispatcher asked her, "If nobody is on the road, why are we going to a multiple car crash?"

Wow Dude that's freaking hilarious!

[Niftymedi911]

Siren may worry/annoy patients.

Siren may impede hearing BP, breath/bowel sounds, communication with pt, ED, base.

Shoulda bought a Horton..............................

[exodus]

We're a BLS only private company (Other than our CCTRN's) but we still rune Code 3 to certain calls where dispatch tells us to. Usually these Code3 calls are for ALOC or Unresponsive.

My first two code 3 calls I was patient person because I was new, and both of those I had our transport run Code 3 to the hospital. After looking back on the two calls I've realized Code3 wasn't needed for transport. Why did I think Code 3 was needed? Because in school we were never taught much on how to decide or the reasoning needed to figure out if we need to go Code 3 to the hospital. They taught us to pretty much just do a check list.

My EMT school sucked I'm figuring out as I go through real experience... Which is why I'm planning on going through a 2 year Associates Degree program for medic

[Richard B the EMT]

I just remembered something I heard in a lecture, many years ago. Does any course still teach this philosophy, especially in regards to siren use?

For the most part, when you arrive at the scene, the emergency is over.

[akroeze]

We're a BLS only private company (Other than our CCTRN's) but we still rune Code 3 to certain calls where dispatch tells us to. Usually these Code3 calls are for ALOC or Unresponsive.

My first two code 3 calls I was patient person because I was new, and both of those I had our transport run Code 3 to the hospital. After looking back on the two calls I've realized Code3 wasn't needed for transport. Why did I think Code 3 was needed? Because in school we were never taught much on how to decide or the reasoning needed to figure out if we need to go Code 3 to the hospital. They taught us to pretty much just do a check list.

My EMT school sucked I'm figuring out as I go through real experience... Which is why I'm planning on going through a 2 year Associates Degree program for medic

You will do well, you have the right attitude!

[HERBIE1]

As for "If I have to be up, everybody has to be up"?

Early on in my career, my dispatcher reported that, as we responded to a call at 0230 hours, some lady called up to complain about the ambulance using the siren (a Federal "Q", which is a loud one), at that hour, and awakening herself and 10 year old grandson. Her attitude was, "there's nobody on the road at that hour, so no need for any noise".

As to the call type, the dispatcher asked her, "If nobody is on the road, why are we going to a multiple car crash?"

LMAO

I LOVED those old Q sirens- nothing like them, although the new ones are a pretty good imitation. I especially loved it when those old Q's were winding down.

BTW-You are showing your age, Richard.

Similar story-

Years ago, the former head of our department lived in the middle of the city, in a highrise apartment. Someone in dispatch got their hands on a memo, not meant for wide circulation, that the chief wanted his subordinates to tell the crews to limit siren use in the downtown area after a certain hour. Apparently he was a light sleeper and was constantly being awakened by the noise.

As you might imagine, when news of this memo spread, every crew within a 5 mile radius of this guy's building made it a point to do a "drive by", blaring the siren and air horn, regardless of the level of traffic. Crews made it a point to plan as many of their responses and transports past this building as humanly possible. We heard through the grapevine that he got the message. LOL

Edited May 22, 2009 by HERBIE1

[sirduke]

So who gets to talk to the caller when the 911 call comes in? Our calls are recieved by the 911 dispatch center, 30 miles away from us, and they page us out by radio. We don't have the option to ask, "Are lights and siren neccessary?"

I've been dispatched to calls that had me bitching about BS only to arrive and have it be Katy bar the door. One particular call comes to mind, woman cut her ankle shaving her legs, 23 miles out from the station. We grumbled about the BS call we were going to, only to arrive and discover she had an abereant artery and she'd sliced it. Blood bath all over the bathroom floor, she was shocky thanks to her coumadin preventing clotting.

Better in my opinion to err on the side of discretion.