Lights and sirens

[tskstorm]

Why did that police officer not drive himself, or have another officer drive him, to a local ED?

Is it all the BS calls that are causing such delays?

Its the call volume vs amount of ambulances available ... 3500 calls a day maybe 70/80 ambulances?

NYPD Policy/protocol prevents such action. I've taken officers to the hospital for everything from minor abrasions, to horses falling on top of them.

[Dustdevil]

In England, they do live, fake, emergency runs, just for practice.

How stupid.

LOL! I love it!

I'm thinking if our dispatchers spent less time dicking around with this worthless EMD nonsense, we could respond faster and get to the scene quicker without having to drive like maniacs with the siren blasting.

[robert gift]

Its the call volume vs amount of ambulances available ... 3500 calls a day maybe 70/80 ambulances?

NYPD Policy/protocol prevents such action. I've taken officers to the hospital for everything from minor abrasions, to horses falling on top of them.

It is moronic protocols that add to the problem.

So you drove red lights and siren to an officer and then took the officer with a boo-boo to the ED to be checked?

It is this wasteful nonsense which is driving us bankrupt.

Horse falling on top can be very severe.

But minor problems they should be able to take themselves.

Edited April 10, 2009 by robert gift

[emt322632]

Ugh I hate this topic...

I had a discussion similiar to this with a probie once, wanting to know why we didn't respond priority to every call because after all "Dispatch could be wrong..."

After I stared blankly at him for a few seconds I responded that it all boils down to safety. The safety of me, my crew, and all other drivers on the road, for it's not just our safety that we have to worry about, but the safety of all other drivers. We must respond with due regard, and if involved in an accident with an emergency vehicle, it would most likely be the responding ambulance/fire apparatus that was held liable for the incident.

I can tell you for a fact that the vast majority of calls in New York State are BLS calls, : http://www.health.state.ny.us/nysdoh/ems/stat.htm

I can't attest for all other states, but I'm betting the statistics are similar. Why put yourself at risk for a basic call?

So...in short...if someone has a hangnail, I'm not responding priority...I refuse to. I refuse to put the lives of myself, my crew, and the other motorists in jeopardy because someone can't afford a bottle of Motrin or use their digits unaffected by a hangnail to call a taxi.

Edited April 10, 2009 by emt322632

[robert gift]

Never said you were schizo just the fixation on the fake calls with lights and sirens in England borders on the schizo or obsessive.

Just kidding.

Which is why, when asked if I were paranoid schizophrenic, I answered, "No we're not."

I'm just ranting about England doing needless live fake emergent runs, when the goal should be to minimize them.

[scott33]

LOL! I love it!

Don't encourage him. He is *cough, cough* special.

My English friends agree

[croaker260]

I'm thinking if our dispatchers spent less time dicking around with this worthless EMD nonsense, we could respond faster and get to the scene quicker without having to drive like maniacs with the siren blasting.

Surprisingly research shows that EMD done by nurses with out cards, just following a loose set of rules, took (IIRC) about 2.5 to 5 minutes to obtain infrmation and complete, where for EMD using MPDS it was about 1-1.5 minutes. Speaking off the op of my head here.

I can tell you several years ago when I did dispatch QA for our agencies central dispatch (it was part of the sheriffs department, all EMD trained) , the average call from beginning to end was in the 45 second range, and the average time to dispatch (Tones dropping) was about 15 seconds when the dispatchers tag teamed, about 1 minute when a single dispatcher ran an entire call.

Obviously when PDI/PAIs (i.e. CPR instructions) where given the total time extended a lot, but the time to initial dispatch remained pretty constant.

[JPINFV]

I can tell you for a fact that the vast majority of calls in New York State are BLS calls, : http://www.health.state.ny.us/nysdoh/ems/stat.htm

Is BLS defined based on patient status or who transported? I'd hate to have someone say that an acute PE is a basic call because a basic unit was dispatched and ALS either wasn't available or further than the hospital.

[brentoli]

That is why YOU ASK if lights and siren are needed.

If you, the dispatcher, are unsure the nature of the call, like it IS a cat scratch, the the caller will tell you "No".

How many vehicle collisions have occured responding to BS calls?

What kind of chip do you have on your shoulder? Seriously. Just come clean and tell us.

I am not advocating every call to be an emergency response. But you want me to ask every 911 caller "Do you feel lights and sirens are needed to respond to your emergency?"

Have you ever really dispatched? The sweet 60 year old grandmother will tell you not to get those people in a big hurry for her husband while you can hear the agonal respirations in the background. Hang up from that call, and you will be getting cussed out from Billy's mom because they aren't there fast enough for his sprained wrist.

I am not going to put my opinion out about EMD. I know the program I use, and I know I don't like it. I have heard about others, and do not have any experience to rate them on.

I require three things before I get the tones started for the ambulance. Address, Phone Number, Chief Complaint. I can get the ambulance out the door once I get those. Then I can spend time on information gathering, calming the caller, EMD.... There are alot of call takers that don't see it that way, or their computers won't allow them to. That is a system failure.

In my region, dispatch should not tell you what your priority response is. We dispatch for 9 diffrent ambulance districts. If I tell you the chief complaint, and any additional information I can gather, you as the EDUCATED MEDICAL PROVIDER should be able to make the decision on your own, based on your agencies standing protocols.

I have had 24 hours of medical training through my dispatching position. Don't include my EMT cert in that, and realize that and refresher training is all that many dispatchers will recieve. So why are the paramedics, who have more than 100 times the medical education hours than I, putting call priority in to my hands?

[Just Plain Ruff]

I think that we as educated medical professionals can decide what we need to respond lights and sirens to and what we don't.

The nausea and vomiting call at 3am probably doesn't need a L/S response

The chest pain at 3am certainly does unless you have no traffic and you live in a rural area.

The fall with ankle injury more than likely does not warrant a emergency response even if the bone is showing. It looks impressive to those who call but seriously, how often do those turn out to be major trauma.

personally while working nights I rarely run hot after midnight because there is rarely much traffic and we get there just as fast without L/S