To Medic's

[Dominion300]

thanks you and be glade you never worked for yellow well never go back to that place

There are many quality programs in Louisville right now you can look into. The one I'm in (Associated with UofL and Dr. Price who is our director) has been very good despite being a pilot program. I don't know much about Know How, etc but I'm happy with where I ended up. I'd still recommend some kind of college A&P, biology and chemistry, math, etc. The class I'm in whenever we start a new A&P section we are given that particular organ system to learn with. Not quite a body a lab but still nice.

I worked for Yellow for awhile, just your standard IFT company.

[fireflymedic]

There are many quality programs in Louisville right now you can look into. The one I'm in (Associated with UofL and Dr. Price who is our director) has been very good despite being a pilot program. I don't know much about Know How, etc but I'm happy with where I ended up. I'd still recommend some kind of college A&P, biology and chemistry, math, etc. The class I'm in whenever we start a new A&P section we are given that particular organ system to learn with. Not quite a body a lab but still nice.

I worked for Yellow for awhile, just your standard IFT company.

Dominion - how is that being run? Is it an offshoot of U of L with the consideration of eventually being degree seeking or are they staying with the accreditation through KBEMS? How long is their program aimed from start to finish? I'm kinda interested as I don't know much about that program and would like to hear a bit more as I try to keep up with the programs in the area. Thanks and yes, there's alot of good programs 'round here !

[Dominion300]

Dominion - how is that being run? Is it an offshoot of U of L with the consideration of eventually being degree seeking or are they staying with the accreditation through KBEMS? How long is their program aimed from start to finish? I'm kinda interested as I don't know much about that program and would like to hear a bit more as I try to keep up with the programs in the area. Thanks and yes, there's alot of good programs 'round here !

The program was originally to run from August 2008 to August 2010. Brandon Heming is the main instructor and he's been doing a good job I think for his first medic class. It's an offshoot right now, officially it's sponsored by UofL and they are working on a degree program. If they can't get the details hammered out for that they want to shoot for accreditation.

The program itself spreads the topics over a long period of time, so for example when we started cardiology we did an A&P class on the heart, blood, and vessels. Then we did cardiology. We also lumped in 'cardiology' drugs. So instead of giving us a stack of drugs to learn in a month or so we've learned some shortly over a period of time. Also we had planned on doing our clinicals near the end of class and running them concurrently with class. So instead of trying to fit in classes, study time, and clinicals we would replace a class day with a clinicals day.

The books we're using is the Mosby Paramedic Super Book and A&P for Emergency Care. We're also doing the standard ACLS, PALS modules and PHTLS, ABLS, AMLS, and a couple other alphabet courses.

However we since scrapped that idea so we could finish the classroom portion in october and we'll start our clinicals then.

We are doing our Peds clinicals at Kosair (ER and OR), UofL ER and OR), Nortons for OR, Doctor shadow time at Kosair and UofL (or nortons), L&D, CCU/ICU, etc. I forget how long it's been since Kosair has let a paramedic class in.

I don't think I'm missing anything, if you have any other questions let me know.

Edited August 12, 2009 by Dominion300

[fireflymedic]

Sounds like a great class. My only concern is the fact they haven't already pushed for accreditation as I know most are already clear with it that though I'm fairly certain being affiliated with U of L and they will end up with it and especially if they can manage to work it into a degree program. At a minimum maybe get it to where they could do a degree completion with the accreditation? I imagine these ideas have been hashed out to some degree already - are they looking at a 2 or 4 year degree option or all the above like EKU? UK used to have a great program, shame they closed it down. Would love to see LCC pick it back up or do a degree completion for those already with it.

[Dominion300]

Sounds like a great class. My only concern is the fact they haven't already pushed for accreditation as I know most are already clear with it that though I'm fairly certain being affiliated with U of L and they will end up with it and especially if they can manage to work it into a degree program. At a minimum maybe get it to where they could do a degree completion with the accreditation? I imagine these ideas have been hashed out to some degree already - are they looking at a 2 or 4 year degree option or all the above like EKU? UK used to have a great program, shame they closed it down. Would love to see LCC pick it back up or do a degree completion for those already with it.

Honestly I don't know too much on the accreditation. I know it's been talked about that they are gathering the materials currently to apply. I don't think the class will have any issue with it either. As far as the degree program I don't know 100%. I was told a few ideas were tossed around and considered. 2 year AS degree where you just have to get your gen eds and then take the program so you can either get your AS degree or enroll without having to get an AS (without doing gen eds). There is a department who said they were interested in giving students a BS in that program with a minor in paramedicine. You'd have to talk to the course leads about that specifically. It's a pretty good program and despite not being accredited I've been happy with it, I looked into other programs and if I'm not mistaken the only two currently accredited programs nearby are EKU and Ivy Tech in IN. I had considered once I get my license heading to Lexington or even nearer to EKU and getting a degree from there. That is if UofL or other college doesn't get one set up.

There HAS been talk of making the AS at UofL (if they give it) retroactive for his class, so you just go do gen eds, basic science courses and you're done. Which would be awesome cause I'd only have to do about one semester MAYBE one year to finish up. Part time at that, I have 62 hours into a biology degree that I decided to not finish right now.

[Mateo_1387]

Now, some widsom I was imparted: It's great to have all that knowledge about A&P and patho and pharm and whatnot but remember, it changes very little about what you auctually do for the patient; keep it simple and be quietly confident that you know the what and why but don't forget the how and when or you will get yourself into trouble out there.

Can you explain this in more detail?

Initially I want to disagree with part of your comment. Before I do, I want to understand exactly what you are meaning behind the comment above.

Thanks

[Kiwiology]

Can you explain this in more detail?

Initially I want to disagree with part of your comment. Before I do, I want to understand exactly what you are meaning behind the comment above.

Thanks

Matt;

By this I mean that we can apply some of what we know to guide or somehow change our treatment (e.g. differentating pneumonia from pulmonary edema to give frusemide) however there is a portion of our knowledge we can't apply because we simply don't carry the drugs, have the ability to perform the procedures or tests required or the application of "book" knowledge won't change what we do.

Example: A kid falls out a tree and breaks his arm. Paramedic's Sparky and Jim Jim roll up and get to treating the kid. Sparky can tell you the anatomy of the bones in the arm, how bones grow, what happens when they break, the stages of fracture healing and how bones do a bunch of other stuff like erythrocytosis, store some toxins, that tendons tie muscle to bone etc etc. Now ole' Paramedic Jim Jim just knows to reduce and split as best as can be done and maybe get some pain relief onboard, none of that fancy big worded junk. I would say most of what Sparky can tell you ain't gonna change jack shit about how we splint this kids arm.

I am by all means an advocate for more education and strongly believe that you can never know too much nor that we should simply educate "skill monkeys" but I was warned that knowing a lot can be dangerous as you can dig yourself into a hole and get "tunnel vision" practicing diagnoistics when the best thing for the patient is for you to take them to the hospital.

[Eydawn]

And this is why I think I might never come back to urban pre-hospital EMS.

It's a "bad thing" for you to think. It's bad to have knowledge, to want to actually think through treatment modalities instead of "put an IV in it, splint it, get vitals, drive, wash your hands."

I don't want to be a god damn taxi cab. I don't even *like* driving emergent. I want to treat my patients and be involved in their care!

This is why we're stuck in the dark ages in EMS.... it's so bass ackwards it's not even funny anymore.

Wendy

CO EMT-B

[fiznat]

I don't want to be a god damn taxi cab. I don't even *like* driving emergent. I want to treat my patients and be involved in their care!

It might not be the popular opinion here, but if you really feel the way you've indicated above, then EMS is not for you. If you really want to be involved with the medicine (and your patients!), you're going to have to go back to school. EMS is not the place for either of those things.

[Eydawn]

Fiz, that's the exact reason that I'm applying to nursing schools. On the waitlist for one, waiting to hear from a competitive entry accelerated BSN program.

Isn't it sad that the M in EMS is neglected so much? I initially got into all of this for the medicine... only to discover very little medicine in the field. Oh well... at least my splinting skills are useful for SAR....

Wendy

CO EMT-B