NYTimes on Fire based EMS

[Richard B the EMT]

What was not mentioned, or I missed seeing in the Times' article, is that NYC is looking to close down several fire companies (both engines and ladder trucks), either on the overnights or total shutdowns, as well as eliminating some 30 EMS ambulance "tours", as a cost saving measure.

I am uncertain if that is translated to the 3 tours a day on 10 ambulances, or removing 30 ambulances from the roughly 250+ ambulances a day we have in the field.

[STAT]

Wow...

so getting back to the article....Anyone care to make any rebuttal? or are we moving on to a new topic all together now?

If so, You know what I hate?

Wal-mart greeters! Fuck those guys!

[FireMedic65]

Wal-mart always gives the FF's free stuff, but never EMS! those jerks!

Well anyway, people just need to stop complaining all the time and start doing their job. If they don't like it, find a new one. Complaining gets you no where, it makes you look like a child. What needs to be done is compiling the facts, statistics, financial figures or the past, present and projected outcome. Then present it to the people who can make a difference. With the proper research and information ready to back up your battle, in a professional manor, might get things done a little better than whining on a forum. Lawyers prepare greatly for their trials, we should prepare just as much to fight for a better profession.

[STAT]

Agreed....Moving on.

[aussiephil]

Out of all the bitching and whining I hear from EMS about how "you can't do two jobs" and "bunker gear and bandages don't mix" or "Firefighters are too dumb to render quality patient care", I NEVER hear anyone bitching about how Law Enforcement is involved in EMS services?

Do bullets and bandages work well together?

Are Police Officers the 'exception to the rule' about not being able to do two jobs?

Isn't the Law Enforcement responders sucking up 'EMS money' too?

If Law Enforcement medics didn't respond, wouldn't that mean that the private carrier medics might have more calls? Oh wait, then there would be MORE room to bitch about being 'overworked'!

Loner,

Never once have I agreed that services should be combined, or run as a sub section of another agency.

I even stated in my original post

Many of you who know me know I do not & never will agree with EMS being the poor cousin to the attention grabbing, camera seeking fire departments, but should be a stand alone, autonomous agency. This article backs that up.

It was fire in this instance because the article refered to NY fire departments. However, I do say EMS should be an

stand alone, autonomous agency

Plain & simple.

If Law Enforcement medics didn't respond, wouldn't that mean that the private carrier medics might have more calls? Oh wait, then there would be MORE room to bitch about being 'overworked'!

I dont agree with any agency having EMS. EMS should not, for emergency work, be run as a 'for profit' business, but EMS can provide basic emergency medicine to many people without cost if run properly. This means that EMS is only done by the EMS agency. Other agencies will all know first aid & CPR, but will not be used as EMS. EMS SHOULD stand alone from all agencies.

There is NEVER a suggestion that Law Enforcment should run fire or vice verca, so why is EMS used as a football to be debated as to the validity of it being a seperate organisation?

[stcommodore]

Most of the comments to this article have covered anything I would say. One of the reasons there are still large amounts of fire apparatus in the cities is because it requires larger amounts of equipment and personel to do that job rather then most of our EMS incidents. Not to mention in a major city if you begin to have more then one large incident, and witness the removal of four engine's and two ladders from your department you'll see how thin fire protection can get.

[HERBIE1]

Out of all the bitching and whining I hear from EMS about how "you can't do two jobs" and "bunker gear and bandages don't mix" or "Firefighters are too dumb to render quality patient care", I NEVER hear anyone bitching about how Law Enforcement is involved in EMS services?

Do bullets and bandages work well together?

Are Police Officers the 'exception to the rule' about not being able to do two jobs?

Isn't the Law Enforcement responders sucking up 'EMS money' too?

If Law Enforcement medics didn't respond, wouldn't that mean that the private carrier medics might have more calls? Oh wait, then there would be MORE room to bitch about being 'overworked'!

Simple question about the article:

Where do you think the firefighters who are complaining get their attitudes from?

[joesph]

So whats wrong with a combined agency? I keep hearing the same complaints but I can't believe that it is a insurmountable problem. Improve training, properly direct funding and find the right personnel that are committed to helping people and not hung up on titles or images and Shazam you have a cost affective all risk emergency response agency.

[Kiwiology]

So whats wrong with a combined agency? I keep hearing the same complaints but I can't believe that it is a insurmountable problem. Improve training, properly direct funding and find the right personnel that are committed to helping people and not hung up on titles or images and Shazam you have a cost affective all risk emergency response agency.

The problem with a "combined" agency is in the word "combined". In most of the world (ok, all of the world except the USA) the ambulance service is a stand-alone agency seperate from the police and fire services. Thier sole interest is vested in transport medicine (or treat-and-non-transport-medicine as the way forward in some cases) not in trying to run a fire department as well.

I've seen this whole "all hazards" bullshit and it's exactly that, it's just a flashy marketing gimic put fwd by the fire union; the fire service here manages OK trained to first responder level here and ambo seems to manaage OK doing thier thing while Fire turns that car into a convertible.

Ambulance should remain a totally seperate entity not being overshadowed or run by the Fire Service, police or any other group for the pure fact it distracts from what we are trying to achieve.

[FireMedic65]

There are plenty of "combined" services that are "separate" FNDY for example. They are a fire department ambulance, but they are not firefighters. City of Allentown, is fun by the City of Allentown Police. Their dual medic ambulances are not all cops, and their cops are not all medics. It is possible to be combined and have separate duties.