Paramedic Cert to Paramedic Degree

[VentMedic]

With so many decent colleges in VA with reasonable tuition, especially at the community college level, why would you want to go with a questionable mail order program? If you are going to do online, just about every college offers that method of teaching for some classes. Using one locally can give you greater access to their resources including the labs. You can probably transfer your Paramedic cert much easier within state to a good A.A.S program. That may leave you only about 24 credits to finish that degree. I still don't see how you 46young, who have preached money matters, could get suckered into such quick fix degrees to suck your money out of your bank accounts with numerous extra fees and out of state tuition as well as classes that may not even pertain to your own state's requirements. Instead of look for some elaborate scheme, just go to your local community college. It is only a cert to Associates degree. They can also do personal counseling for the correct classes for your goals and get you financial aid advice if you need it. At this point I don't think you have a clue what you want to do so it is best you get advice that can be applied broadly. Also, if you choose an out of state program, those classes may have difficulty coming into your state especially if they are from a private school. And remember, some science and math classes have a time limit for transfer which is 5 or 7 years depending on the state.

Also, if you want to obtain another health degree in the future, you need to take real college level A&P and pharmacology. Trying to CLEP out of these classes based on the overview sections of these courses offered in a Paramedic cert program is not a good idea. Picking up a book entitled CLEPPING Pharmacology for Dummies is also not a good idea as the title will give you some clue as to why. If you do not have a thorough understanding of these subjects, while you might pass the course, you may just skim by which does the patients who will be in your care a disservice. Inhospital and critical care (including CCT) pharmacology requires an indepth understanding and not just a gloss over. Med-surg pharmacology alone can be very expansive with numerous meds and the provider must understand the meds well enough to teach as well as just do the skill of setting the med at bedside after matching the names of the medications from the orders.

Edited December 2, 2009 by VentMedic

[spenac]

Read his posts on other sites and you will find he states he is starting this and other topics just to start fights and to laugh at the truly educated peoples responses.

[46Young]

With so many decent colleges in VA with reasonable tuition, especially at the community college level, why would you want to go with a questionable mail order program? If you are going to do online, just about every college offers that method of teaching for some classes. Using one locally can give you greater access to their resources including the labs. You can probably transfer your Paramedic cert much easier within state to a good A.A.S program. That may leave you only about 24 credits to finish that degree. I still don't see how you 46young, who have preached money matters, could get suckered into such quick fix degrees to suck your money out of your bank accounts with numerous extra fees and out of state tuition as well as classes that may not even pertain to your own state's requirements. Instead of look for some elaborate scheme, just go to your local community college. It is only a cert to Associates degree. They can also do personal counseling for the correct classes for your goals and get you financial aid advice if you need it. At this point I don't think you have a clue what you want to do so it is best you get advice that can be applied broadly. Also, if you choose an out of state program, those classes may have difficulty coming into your state especially if they are from a private school. And remember, some science and math classes have a time limit for transfer which is 5 or 7 years depending on the state.

Also, if you want to obtain another health degree in the future, you need to take real college level A&P and pharmacology. Trying to CLEP out of these classes based on the overview sections of these courses offered in a Paramedic cert program is not a good idea. Picking up a book entitled CLEPPING Pharmacology for Dummies is also not a good idea as the title will give you some clue as to why. If you do not have a thorough understanding of these subjects, while you might pass the course, you may just skim by which does the patients who will be in your care a disservice. Inhospital and critical care (including CCT) pharmacology requires an indepth understanding and not just a gloss over. Med-surg pharmacology alone can be very expansive with numerous meds and the provider must understand the meds well enough to teach as well as just do the skill of setting the med at bedside after matching the names of the medications from the orders.

I posted that link to show what I thought a potential scam might look like. NOVA Annandale Campus and Tidewater look like two options worth exploring here.

I discussed previously the need for educational points for career development at my job. Those educational points become progressively more valuable as you move up the career ladder, and lack of such points will result in lack of career advancement. I originally thought that I would go for ASN or RRT. Having to go FT instead of being able to go PT to work around a busy work schedule makes that an undesireable option at the moment. I plan to get a two year degree quickly for career advancement purposes, and then pursue the ASN or RRT a few years down the road, with a goal of completion by 2016. I then thought of maybe a fire science degree, but I feel that it has little value at this early juncture of my career.

That leaves the medic degree. I'm not looking to CLEP out of pre reqs, but I feel that I shouldn't have to repeat much of the actual course content or clinicals, having already done so at my tech school. I also have 4+ years of related ALS experience for busy systems. How much they're willing to credit me for remains to be seen, but the 24 credits or so you mentioned seems about right. Hopefully much of that (clinicals/labs notwithstanding) will be online. I feel that the medic degree would be the easiest, quickest and most relevant course of study at this juncture. I'd like to teach at some point in the future, and perhaps work in an admin position for EMS in a FD or third service agency post retirement. A medic degree would be a good start. Members of EMS admin have contacts with NOVA and Tidewater, so I'll see where that goes. I finally secured an appointment at the career development office next week. I'll discuss the results of the meeting, so others that may wish to upgrade to a degree can benefit.

Read his posts on other sites and you will find he states he is starting this and other topics just to start fights and to laugh at the truly educated peoples responses.

I know what thread on emtlife you're talking about. What I said is that it's amusing to give another viewpoint, a valid one, and get a strong response. Nothing I've posted was fabricated. It may go against the grain, but it's not fantasy. With another thread here I mentioned opportunity cost. Check my math if you like. Someone with a tech cert could save 10 grand annually for 10 consecutive years, put it in a balanced ETF (or retail fund) gaining 7-8% on average, and then just leave it there for the remaining 30 years of their career. They'll have over 2 million at retirement. Imagine if they continue to contribute into deferred comp. Or if their contributions were to increase with salary increases. The MD, who doesn't really start earning until they're in their 30's should be able to do the same thing, but it will take a much larger contribution to accomplish that. College is important, but it's not the only path to prosperity. All I was saying is that one should have opportunity cost in mind when they choose their course of action.

[VentMedic]

I discussed previously the need for educational points for career development at my job. Those educational points become progressively more valuable as you move up the career ladder, and lack of such points will result in lack of career advancement. I originally thought that I would go for ASN or RRT. Having to go FT instead of being able to go PT to work around a busy work schedule makes that an undesireable option at the moment. I plan to get a two year degree quickly for career advancement purposes, and then pursue the ASN or RRT a few years down the road, with a goal of completion by 2016. I then thought of maybe a fire science degree, but I feel that it has little value at this early juncture of my career.

That leaves the medic degree.

This post only makes you appear very unorganized and clueless about any of the other career choices or what they are about. The RN and RRT are very different degrees and not everyone is cut out to be either. RT is a specialty. The RN has a culture all to its own and people who enter now just because of the money are being washed out quickly if they have no interest in patient care. Since you are constantly bringing up your checkbook rather than any aspect of patient care, you fit into that category. You truly don't know what you want and can't seem to justify your motives for any direction be it firefighting as a public service and leadership promotion or being a Paramedic with patient care in mind.

Check my math if you like. Someone with a tech cert could save 10 grand annually for 10 consecutive years, put it in a balanced ETF (or retail fund) gaining 7-8% on average, and then just leave it there for the remaining 30 years of their career. They'll have over 2 million at retirement. Imagine if they continue to contribute into deferred comp. Or if their contributions were to increase with salary increases. The MD, who doesn't really start earning until they're in their 30's should be able to do the same thing, but it will take a much larger contribution to accomplish that. College is important, but it's not the only path to prosperity. All I was saying is that one should have opportunity cost in mind when they choose their course of action.

You have discussed this to a nauseating level on all the forums.

Education is an investment that can last a lifetime. Your bank account may not last to the end of the year given the right circumstances be it illness or a good scam draining it.

You have totally selfish reasons for getting ONLY a tech cert and you seem to keep forgetting there are patients involved that deserve someone who can calculate their medications and not someone who is not distracted by constantly balancing their retirement fund. Even with the Paramedic cert which will give you credits at a community college that offers an EMS degree, you make an extra 20 - 30 credits sound like a doctorate program that will waste years of your time. Don't go back to college. Do patient care, EMS, RT and Nursing a favor; stay on an engine and stop whining. You've already done enough damage to FF/Paramedics who do take their jobs serious enough to continue their education and are in it for the patient care. This also goes for the FF who continue to a Fire degree. Others working for the FD have found ways to continue their education. Those who haven't advanced their education at least can come up with a better excuse than you. If you can not see the importance of education as it pertains to the future of EMS or how it benefits the patients, just stay on an engine and continue to obsess over your money.

Edited December 3, 2009 by VentMedic

[46Young]

This post only makes you appear very unorganized and clueless about any of the other career choices or what they are about. The RN and RRT are very different degrees and not everyone is cut out to be either. RT is a specialty. The RN has a culture all to its own and people who enter now just because of the money are being washed out quickly if they have no interest in patient care. Since you are constantly bringing up your checkbook rather than any aspect of patient care, you fit into that category. You truly don't know what you want and can't seem to justify your motives for any direction be it firefighting as a public service and leadership promotion or being a Paramedic with patient care in mind.

You have discussed this to a nauseating level on all the forums.

Education is an investment that can last a lifetime. Your bank account may not last to the end of the year given the right circumstances be it illness or a good scam draining it.

You have totally selfish reasons for getting ONLY a tech cert and you seem to keep forgetting there are patients involved that deserve someone who can calculate their medications and not someone who is not distracted by constantly balancing their retirement fund. Even with the Paramedic cert which will give you credits at a community college that offers an EMS degree, you make an extra 20 - 30 credits sound like a doctorate program that will waste years of your time. Don't go back to college. Do patient care, EMS, RT and Nursing a favor; stay on an engine and stop whining. You've already done enough damage to FF/Paramedics who do take their jobs serious enough to continue their education and are in it for the patient care. This also goes for the FF who continue to a Fire degree. Others working for the FD have found ways to continue their education. Those who haven't advanced their education at least can come up with a better excuse than you. If you can not see the importance of education as it pertains to the future of EMS or how it benefits the patients, just stay on an engine and continue to obsess over your money.

Education for any prospective career is an important and vaild topic. The financial aspect is equally important and valid. It's not selfish to seek a quicker way to a higher salary, it simply smart and efficient. If I'm nauseating you about finances, then I'm sure others are nauseated by your constant derision of those in EMS lacking a degree. It's as it they're incapable, as a whole, of being effective providers without a degree. A proper college education ought to prepare one better for the field, sure, but I know plenty of individuals with tech certs who do well.

Hey, I'm not whining about anything. I choose the most efficient way to go about things. I got my medic cert through a 14 month program, and chose the more financially appealing route of the firemedic over pursuing an RN degree at the time. I still have the option of earning an RN degree or upgrading to a medic degree, or both. I'm not confused about where to progress, it's just that there are so many options available, with no pressure due to lack of money or revolving debt. It's called having your cake and eating it too. When I asked about RT vs RN vs fire science, I was wondering aloud about which option would be best. Do I want to promote quickly within the dept, or do I want to complete a healthcare related degree for side work and a fall back option? What's the opportunity cost of delaying promotion when I can satisfy educational points first and pursue other avenues in healthcare after the fact? I would enjoy working in the hospial setting, so having a degree to that end that allows me to work that on the side, as well as have it as a fallback in the event of injury makes it a desireable option. I have several goals in mind, it's just a matter of assigning priorities and finding the most efficient way of achieving them.

I'm currently seeking to do as much online as possible as I have a young daughter at home and another one due in Jan. I screwed my wife over when I went to medic school. She gave birth to my first in August, and I was in class in Oct. 32-40 hours/wk when clinicals started, while working FT. I'd rather spend more time with my family and do as much online as possible. Going FT for RN or RRT is something that I'll be more open to in 4-5 years or so. If I were able to complete either degree doing only 3-9 credits at a time (depending on availability) I would have been chipping away at it all along. Other professions allow it, but not many healthcare related programs. I'm not confused, just weighing my options. It's nice to have options. It may sound glib to throw around (side) career options that others do FT and wholeheartedly, but it's not intended to be so.

[VentMedic]

Hey, I'm not whining about anything. I choose the most efficient way to go about things. I got my medic cert through a 14 month program, and chose the more financially appealing route of the firemedic over pursuing an RN degree at the time. I still have the option of earning an RN degree or upgrading to a medic degree, or both. I'm not confused about where to progress, it's just that there are so many options available, with no pressure due to lack of money or revolving debt. It's called having your cake and eating it too. When I asked about RT vs RN vs fire science, I was wondering aloud about which option would be best.

You're not confused?

Fire science deals with fire stuff.

RN and RT, both different degrees, deal with medical stuff.

You have stated over and over on the forums that a tech cert is good enough for EMS. You have balanced you retirement fund numerous times on the forums.

If you don't have a clue about what you want to be none of us can help you out. If your worried constantly about the financial side, just be a FF. If your FD allows you to drop your Paramedic cert, even better.

Believe it or not there are many of us in EMS who own homes and have a nice retirement set up. We also managed to get our education without all of this drama. The reason most of us were successful is we know we wanted to do patient care and be good at it. Success and prosperity comes in many ways when you do what makes you happy. It sounds like even the FD wasn't your choice career either but you did it for the money. That in itself is scary for the public you serve and the FFs who might have to depend on you if you are not preoccupied texting your accountant.

[46Young]

You're not confused?

Fire science deals with fire stuff.

RN and RT, both different degrees, deal with medical stuff.

You have stated over and over on the forums that a tech cert is good enough for EMS. You have balanced you retirement fund numerous times on the forums.

If you don't have a clue about what you want to be none of us can help you out. If your worried constantly about the financial side, just be a FF. If your FD allows you to drop your Paramedic cert, even better.

Believe it or not there are many of us in EMS who own homes and have a nice retirement set up. We also managed to get our education without all of this drama. The reason most of us were successful is we know we wanted to do patient care and be good at it. Success and prosperity comes in many ways when you do what makes you happy. It sounds like even the FD wasn't your choice career either but you did it for the money. That in itself is scary for the public you serve and the FFs who might have to depend on you if you are not preoccupied texting your accountant.

OMG how many times do I have to explain this?

I've said that a tech cert can be adequate if you go to the right school. Case in point would be Stonybrook's paramedic program in Suffolk County, NY. Most medics in the greater NY area are tech grads. Go to NY Presbyterian or North Shore LIJ, two solid agencies that do both NYC 911 and IFT, and tell them they're stupid because they lack a degree. Don't take my word for it, go call the NSUH Manhasset ED and ask them their opinion of the hospital's EMS. A degree is necessary, or at least more helpful for career advancement into an admin position, or satisfying pre-reqs for other degrees.

At the present, I've given career development within the FRD top priority. I enjoy both sides of the job. It's about the money of course, but I love coming to work and give myself 100% to job performance. Any degree will do to satisfy the educational points for the promotional list. Fire science would be easy to accomplish, but it's useless outside of the FD until you're testing for Batt. Chief. After satisfying the education points, I plan to pursue a degree as either an RRT or RN. I'd honestly enjoy the work. Just not FT as my first choice, but I'd choose those fields over many others if that makes sense. I'd likely be pursuing that if the fire thing never materialized. At my hosp based EMS job in NY, we had fixed schedules. Completing an ASN or RRT FT would be doable with a fixed schedule tailored to school. I've thought about PA, but I can't leave work to satisfy the time requirement necessary. These degrees, the BSN, RRT, PA and such are more tailored for the young adult who is still living with their parents, with few financial obligations, certainly not a working professional with a family.

So, I feel that the best course of action would be to earn the medic degree (both for the quick education points and the desire to begin teaching in a few years), then an ASN degree (the 4 years for RRT, FT, isn't looking possible with my rotating schedule). I may then go for BSN later. I may also do emergency management before the BSN if it will aid in career advancement. When I retire at 58, with a 75% pension, a three year DROP and my 457, I'd like to work either as an RN (maybe RT, who knows, I've got time to decide) part time, because I want to, not because I have to. I'd like a flexible schedule for travel. I'd like my deferred comp continue to compound post "retirement", and also for the DROP money to compound. The purpose of the DROP is to pay for the increased medical plan premium until medicare kicks in. If I can pay that with my PT post retirement salary, that DROP money (it'll be at least 500k) will likely double. Rule of 72 - divide 72 by the interest rate, and that's approx. how long your principal will take to double. Many retirees (or near retirees) screw this up by changing their portfolio to mostly bonds, money market, CD's or T-bills. Since money grows exponentially, the last 10 years of compounding are the most effective. Any decent balanced fund with maybe 60% in equities and 40% in bonds should net at least 7% over the long term (10 years or more).

Define "nice retirement". That's a subjective term. Care to enlighten? What amount and type of assets do you feel one needs in retirement to be financially secure? Job satisfaction is important, sure, but that doesn'r necessary translate into prosperity. I'd like to be able to afford to eat, have a roof over my head and afford meds in retirement, and not have to sign off on a reverse mortgage to do it.

I don't see how going into the fire service for the compensation is supposed to make me an inferior FF. I enjoy the work, and even if I didn't, I would still do the job well. How many people truly enjoy their career choice in the long term? I mean truly enjoy? How can accounting, law, working the floor at the NYSE, managing a McDonalds, Target, or a supermarket be truly enjoyable for those working these positions? How many disgruntled medics and RN's have you come across? It doesn't mean that they're incometent and a danger to others, just burnt.

[fireflymedic]

I've said that a tech cert can be adequate if you go to the right school. Case in point would be Stonybrook's paramedic program in Suffolk County, NY. Most medics in the greater NY area are tech grads. Go to NY Presbyterian or North Shore LIJ, two solid agencies that do both NYC 911 and IFT, and tell them they're stupid because they lack a degree. Don't take my word for it, go call the NSUH Manhasset ED and ask them their opinion of the hospital's EMS. A degree is necessary, or at least more helpful for career advancement into an admin position, or satisfying pre-reqs for other degrees.

It's also neccessary if you want someone to look at you seriously and to give you an edge for a competitive position. Medic mill medics are a dime a dozen - you need to stand out and your resume gets you the interview. If there's nothing outstanding about you on paper, what is going to make them advance to grant your an interview? Something to think about.

At the present, I've given career development within the FRD top priority. I enjoy both sides of the job. It's about the money of course, but I love coming to work and give myself 100% to job performance. Any degree will do to satisfy the educational points for the promotional list. Fire science would be easy to accomplish, but it's useless outside of the FD until you're testing for Batt. Chief. After satisfying the education points, I plan to pursue a degree as either an RRT or RN. I'd honestly enjoy the work. Just not FT as my first choice, but I'd choose those fields over many others if that makes sense. I'd likely be pursuing that if the fire thing never materialized. At my hosp based EMS job in NY, we had fixed schedules. Completing an ASN or RRT FT would be doable with a fixed schedule tailored to school. I've thought about PA, but I can't leave work to satisfy the time requirement necessary. These degrees, the BSN, RRT, PA and such are more tailored for the young adult who is still living with their parents, with few financial obligations, certainly not a working professional with a family.

If you are really looking to forward your clinical knowledge you will find a way to make things happen. No all the other options are NOT tailored for those still living at home with their parents. Plenty complete it while working additional jobs. Or if you have managed things so well as you state, then you will have the luxury of going part time and completing school. It's a matter of how badly you want to do it. If you are motivated you can make it happen. I completed a bachelors paramedic degree while working 16 hour days 6 days a week - was it easy oh heck no, but I wanted it bad enough to make it happen.

So, I feel that the best course of action would be to earn the medic degree (both for the quick education points and the desire to begin teaching in a few years), then an ASN degree (the 4 years for RRT, FT, isn't looking possible with my rotating schedule). I may then go for BSN later. I may also do emergency management before the BSN if it will aid in career advancement. When I retire at 58, with a 75% pension, a three year DROP and my 457, I'd like to work either as an RN (maybe RT, who knows, I've got time to decide) part time, because I want to, not because I have to. I'd like a flexible schedule for travel. I'd like my deferred comp continue to compound post "retirement", and also for the DROP money to compound. The purpose of the DROP is to pay for the increased medical plan premium until medicare kicks in. If I can pay that with my PT post retirement salary, that DROP money (it'll be at least 500k) will likely double. Rule of 72 - divide 72 by the interest rate, and that's approx. how long your principal will take to double. Many retirees (or near retirees) screw this up by changing their portfolio to mostly bonds, money market, CD's or T-bills. Since money grows exponentially, the last 10 years of compounding are the most effective. Any decent balanced fund with maybe 60% in equities and 40% in bonds should net at least 7% over the long term (10 years or more).

Being a medic doesn't make you a great teacher - much more than that goes into it. Unfortunately the liberal education requirements for instructor certs in most states has contributed to the sorry education state for medics. I'm all for saying that instructors should be required to have a degree - at a minimum being associates. It's about education and learning not about just handing out cards. Very few if any professions have instructors without degrees so please explain to me why EMS does? If it's good enough for them, then I think it's time for us to step up if we want to be recognized as a profession. On the issue of retirement - I'll retire at 38 with 20 years at full benefits and pay. I live completely debt free short of my mortgage and by the vast majority of people am considered successful. We aren't coming to you for financial advice - many of us do quite well. If you obviously aren't considering progressing to an additional profession for several years I highly suggest waiting a few years, gaining maturity, and thoroughly researching the professions in question. If you are just looking for fulfilling "education points" (yes I'm familiar with FD promotions I was in FD for several years) then may I suggest classes at your local community college? A great A and P class with lab compliments any medic education quite nicely and a fantastic place to start regardless of further education you choose. But if you want to advance within a FD (as you clearly state you have no plans on leaving to work job full time) then fire science is where to go. But here's something to think about FF and medics get hurt - on and off the job with career ending injuries - think about that when you are choosing a degree.

Define "nice retirement". That's a subjective term. Care to enlighten? What amount and type of assets do you feel one needs in retirement to be financially secure? Job satisfaction is important, sure, but that doesn'r necessary translate into prosperity. I'd like to be able to afford to eat, have a roof over my head and afford meds in retirement, and not have to sign off on a reverse mortgage to do it.

I have all of the above and most likely will continue to do well. My vehicle is completely paid off, I was able to place a significant down payment on my house making my mortgage payment less than I paid for rent, no school loans to pay off, and can do enjoyable things in life. I doubt I'll be signing a reverse mortgage in my "golden years".

I don't see how going into the fire service for the compensation is supposed to make me an inferior FF. I enjoy the work, and even if I didn't, I would still do the job well. How many people truly enjoy their career choice in the long term? I mean truly enjoy? How can accounting, law, working the floor at the NYSE, managing a McDonalds, Target, or a supermarket be truly enjoyable for those working these positions? How many disgruntled medics and RN's have you come across? It doesn't mean that they're incometent and a danger to others, just burnt.

How do you know? They may very well enjoy their jobs. I told myself when I no longer enjoyed it I would call it quits and I'll hold by that. Burt nurses, medics, docs, whatever ARE incompetent because they lose their compassion for their patients and it's that apathetic attitude that leads to mistakes, obnoxious statements, and general lack of caring. I'm sorry - your in a public SERVICE profession not a cubicle with a keyboard. It's your job to care and when you no longer do so it's time to bow out gracefully rather than burn out. Sometimes you just need a break, sometimes you need to quit. But I think if you don't enjoy it you need to evaluate yourself and consider a career change. It may no longer be for you (perhaps it never was?). If you enjoy FD great. I started in FD for the similar reasons - due to the set up of the state at the time, the only respectable services were fire run. They had more aggressive protocols and paid better and were the only thing with state retirement. The only other options were worthless county services or be a transport jockey, neither of which I cared for. For a variety of reasons I left fire, left the state for a bit, worked within an ER and clinic, then state changed EMS structure to primarily county based providing better opportunities for straight EMS so I came back. Nothing wrong with that. And how many disgruntled medics and RN have I come across? Far too many, but the RN are getting weeded out quickly if they have no interest in patient care. Recently spoke with a seasoned nurse and she made the comment how they are having trouble hiring nurses still because they can't find ones interested in patient care - they all want to do management. THey did it for the money not because they loved it or wanted to give good patient care and they aren't lasting long when they find out it's not the picture that's presented.

I think you have a long way to go, alot of research and hard looking at yourself before you make a major financial obligation towards another career. Best of luck to you.

Edited December 4, 2009 by fireflymedic

[46Young]

Update - Career Development advised me that all community colleges in VA have 100% transfer between them. These credits are also honored 100% by all 4 year universities in state as well. That's cool, because someone who seeks a 4 year degree only needs to pay the big bucks for the final two years.

The educational requirements for promotion are currently being restructured, but education will be weighed heavily. For certain, promotion to LT will require an Assosciate's, and promotion to Capt I and above will require a Bachelor's at the minimum. Degrees need to be job related, so RN, EMS, Emergency Management, Business Admin, EMS Management, etc. are all desireable. I won't need a Bachelor's for at least another 7-8 years, so I'll likely go EMS AAS, ASN, then EMS admin. I'll do fire science later, if I'm bored, as these other degrees will help career advancement to a greater degree.

I've been advised that a medic tech cert will satisfy 40-42 credits. I'm not 100% sure of the exact #, but 40-42 or so for someone with no previous college is closely approximate. The program totals 68 credits. If my credits from Baruch transfer, I can use my elem Calculus, Psy, Soc, Eng, etc. My accounting credits will likely be obsolete for possible future application for a BBA/MBA program in the distant future if I decide to go that route (not likely, but you never know). Add in pharm and A&P, and I'm looking at maybe 15-20 credits at the most to complete the degree. I don't know why this didn't idea didn't occur to me several years ago.

http://www.nvcc.edu/curcatalog/programs/pdf/ememed.pdf

Given the current state of EMS education, it's unlikely in the near future that the majority of prospective medics will opt for a degree program when easier, more efficient options exist, and are also abundant. I don't see it. The field is largely transient in nature, no one can deny that. When touting the benefits and necessity of legitimate education to advance the profession, both on internet forums and in the field, I believe that significant headway could be made by persuading cert medics to upgrade to a degree. It's not as desireable as starting off with a degree, but it's certainly much better than doing nothing. Perhaps the instruction in tech schools was substandard (depending on where you go) but going Medic tech cert > EMS AAS will still result in a higher percentage of the workforce holding degrees, for the benefit of the profession. A tech cert basically covers 60% or more of a degree program, and the remainer can be done piecemeal, one class at a time if one desires. Someone who doesn't have 2-3 years to complete an AAS initially can still do it while working FT having gone the cert route.