FireFighters

[aussiephil]

Can't we please just play together nicely? No more peeing in the sandbox children !

Is that like the dont eat yellow snow warning???????

I dont have hose envy. I dont need it. Most firemen I know have 2 penises, cause no one could be that stupid playing with just 1.

fire when we have an entrapped pt

Its interesting you say that. If i look at the history of rescue services in the state where I live, & I am talking road, vertical rescue etc, it was never started by Fire. It was started by the Ambulance Service. The Police also joined in & Fire, trying to justify their existance took it over.

Rescue is medical, not mechanical. You need the medical knowledge to make a truly informed decision on rescue.

If we were being true to what we are saying, then we should have seperate (Paid) Police, who only look after Law Enforcement, Ambulance services whos core business is pre hospital medicine, Seperate & fully funded rescue, whose core role is to provide rescue services & Fire, who should stick with their core role of fighting fires & stay away from others core business. I am sure if you were to do this as a study, most fire would close & become retained or volly. As is should be. this then means that funds can be redirected to the appropriate resources as requires without the hero seekers taking the lions share.

[fireflymedic]

Is that like the dont eat yellow snow warning???????

Umm yeah phil - don't play with the wet sand okay?

Its interesting you say that. If i look at the history of rescue services in the state where I live, & I am talking road, vertical rescue etc, it was never started by Fire. It was started by the Ambulance Service. The Police also joined in & Fire, trying to justify their existance took it over.

Rescue is medical, not mechanical. You need the medical knowledge to make a truly informed decision on rescue.

If we were being true to what we are saying, then we should have seperate (Paid) Police, who only look after Law Enforcement, Ambulance services whos core business is pre hospital medicine, Seperate & fully funded rescue, whose core role is to provide rescue services & Fire, who should stick with their core role of fighting fires & stay away from others core business. I am sure if you were to do this as a study, most fire would close & become retained or volly. As is should be. this then means that funds can be redirected to the appropriate resources as requires without the hero seekers taking the lions share.

I have absolutely no objections to fire maintaining rescue. Yeah it's fun to cut up cars and might as well give them something else to do since they've basically put themselves out of work otherwise, here independent "rescue squads" that are all volunteer run the extrications, high angle, trench etc. The problem with that is they don't train enough to maintain their skills. I think rescue is a good niche for fire, but I'm agreed, I think fire has taken over far too much, but that is for another day and not here. I would have no problem with fire being all volly squads, except for the same response issue you run into with volunteer EMS. Also there are skills that have to be maintained, but I think funds should be alloted according to percentage of run volume and earmarked solely for EMS use (if that is the largest portion) with nothing being able to be jointly used for fire. Keep 'em separate kids !

[aussiephil]

I have absolutely no objections to fire maintaining rescue.

Why? They should prove they deserve it. There is an assumption (wrongly) that fire & rescue go together. Fire departments were formed to fight fires. Let the do that. If that means they have to close cause there are not enough fires TOUGH!

Yeah it's fun to cut up cars and might as well give them something else to do since they've basically put themselves out of work otherwise, here independent "rescue squads" that are all volunteer run the extrications, high angle, trench etc. The problem with that is they don't train enough to maintain their skills.

Then that needs to be addressed through a controling body. I know of professional units that are the same, because rescue is not their primary function. I also know of volly rescue units that are dedicated & highly professional in all that they do.

I think rescue is a good niche for fire, but I'm agreed, I think fire has taken over far too much, but that is for another day and not here.

Maybe we could split this thread into another to debate this point.

I would have no problem with fire being all volly squads, except for the same response issue you run into with volunteer EMS.

You run into the same problem with paid as well. It is called apathy. If people have a true & genuine interest, then they will maintain their skills. I am suggesting however more than just a volly or paid option, regardless of EMS or fire. Pay a retainer, say $100 per month & a set amount per call for up to say 4 hours, then per hour after that. Then they are semi professional & you can dictate what skills & qualifications they must maintain.

Also there are skills that have to be maintained, but I think funds should be alloted according to percentage of run volume and earmarked solely for EMS use (if that is the largest portion) with nothing being able to be jointly used for fire. Keep 'em separate kids !

Fire will always try to take allotted funds. EMS will always be the poor cousin. Why? Who do you see on the TV when there is a really bad car wreck on a freeway? Fire, because they are there for an extended period. EMS in most cases will be off scene before any media arrive. There needs to be a balance & funding should be allotted to each area seperatly depending on how much they do. Sorry fire, if you pale into insignificance, oh well.

Maybe this is Virgil.......

Edited January 10, 2010 by aussiephil

[Richard B the EMT]

I don't think EMS belongs out of public safety, but should be one unto itself - there is no talk of combining police and fire - totally separate things. But oh yeah, cops work accidents and firefighters extricate so they could be together, and cops could be first responders !

Ever heard of the Port Authority of New York-New Jersey Police? They were the main LEOs at the World Trade Center, and still are the main LEOs at JF Kennedy, LaGuardia, and Newark-Liberty International Airports.

These folks are all dual state authorized LEOs, are trained to either New York or New Jersey State Paramedic level (with bi-state reciprocity), and operate the fire crash/rescue trucks at those airports. They also operate mini-attack pumper/tow car vehicles on Port Authority controlled trans-Hudson River bridges and tunnels.

One agency, cross-trained as LEO, FD, EMT-P, and tow vehicle operators. Combined.

Thought you might want to know.