Off Duty Safety

[VentMedic]

Some really sad news articles on the FF Close Calls site.

This one is for the numerous newcomers to EMS who are anxious to equip their POV with trauma bags and cruise the roads looking for excitement. It is dangerous to approach any scene off duty especially when you are just starting out. Never put yourself or your family at risk. My thoughts and prayers go out to the family of this off duty FF who not only lost a loved one but had to witness it as well. Keep yourself and your family safe. Dial 911. If you really feel you must stop, get your vehicle to a very safe parking spot and don't become part of the scene as another patient. Stop only if you can make a difference and not just to be part of the gawkers.

The family of this FF may or may not collect his benefits but he is dead.

http://firefighterclosecalls.com/fullstory.php?98816

VERMONT FIREFIGHTER KILLED WHILE RENDERING AID

Monday, December 28, 2009 - An off-duty Shoreham Volunteer Firefighter was killed while helping at the scene of a car crash.

It happened at about 6:30 p.m. Sunday evening at an on Richville Dam Road in Shoreham. There was heavy fog and the roads were icy when police say a car, driven by 26-year-old Rachel Herrick of Shoreham, was heading west when she slid off the road into a ditch. Volunteer firefighter, 43-year-old Peter Coe of Shoreham, was driving with his family when he reportedly pulled over and got out of his car to help.

That's when police say the driver of an oncoming pickup truck, who didn't see Coe's car due to its location, tried to avoid hitting the car. The driver, 30-year-old Jason Vandeweert of Addison, reportedly went off the road, hitting Coe, a power line, a tree and Herrick's car.

Coe died from his injuries. Vandeweert wasn't seriously hurt. The accident is still under investigation but no charges have been filed.

[treaux]

Very sad to hear. I personally have never stopped at an accident while off-duty for that very reason. I know an engine and an ambulance can be there in 5 minutes, and there's hardly anything I can do in that 5 minutes to make a difference. Remember that your safety is always first.

Thanks for the article Vent.

[Lisa O]

How sad. My thoughts are with his family.

[fireflymedic]

It is very dependent on the situation whether I stop or not. If nobody is there, I'll check to make sure everybody's okay and offer to let them call in or ask if I can help in any way, as it can take quite a while in our area to get a response (depending on weather it very well may be an hour or so). I think that's what any decent person would do. However, if emergency vehicles are there, then I won't bother to stop, especially if I am out of my area. If I do stop, I'd keep it to basic interventions, but I'm sorry, I'm not heartless enough to see someone go through a severe accident and if they are severely bleeding, etc walking away from it. I feel that makes me no better than the NY EMT's/dispatchers (whatever they are/were) we are debating their actions. I am sticking to basic first aid interventions and the chances of me stopping with my family in the car (if my situation was not what it is) would be slim.

Thanks for posting this Vent - makes us all aware of safety even further now. Thoughts and prayers with his family, friends, and coworkers.

Edited December 28, 2009 by fireflymedic

[mffrhorne]

I do not know if it is still true but at one time having a drivers license in Vermont imposed a duty to stop and render assistance to the best of your ability if you were the first uninvolved driver to find the wreck. That information is decades old and I can only hope that the state has changed it's rules to some more common sense approach.

I do stop if it is safe to do so but I would not have stopped at the roadside under the conditions that existed in this incident. I also have a very strong advantage in that my work vehicle is equipped with a road hazard beacon, an arrow board, and five of the thirty six inch traffic cones with the double reflective stripes. That equipment is required for electricians who work adjacent to class three (high speed) roadways. I still will not stop if I cannot position out of the travel lanes. If I can, then I do what I can, with a regular jump bag, that is provided by my fire department. It is often true that the most I can do is to try to prevent a second accident. I do not carry step chocks or immobilization equipment so I have no business entering a car unless someone is in extremis and there is some effective intervention I can perform. My concern about entering the car is that at over two hundred pounds and six feet three inches in height I'm bound to cause some motion in any light vehicle I enter. In keeping with first of all do no harm preventing a second collision is often all that I can effectively achieve.

--

Tom Horne

[P_Instructor]

Scene safety is scene safety, no matter while on duty or not. This gentleman looks like he took an oath to help whenever he could. The circumstances apparantly were stacked against him. Sometimes it is just a shame. My prayers are with the family.

On a personal note, I probably would have stopped also to render aid.

[VentMedic]

As a public safety officier he may have had some obligation but does that mean his family has also? Putting bystanders and your own family at risk must be considered. You generally want to remove bystanders from a scene and not drive them to it. One has to remember when you are in your own car, even if it tricked out with a bunch of lights, it is not going to be as visible as a fire truck. Even a fire truck can be a major obstruction if not carefully parked to where it will not endanger others including the rescuers. Also, if you were on duty at a scene like this, one thing you would probably do is prevent people in private vehicles from parking as he did. Stopping is one thing but don't forget everything you have been taught and trained to do safely.

Edited January 5, 2010 by VentMedic

[RavEMTGun]

I'm happy to stop and offer some first aid if there is a situation that looks needful and nobody is on scene, but only if it is safe for me. I drove past a wreck the other day that I might have stopped for because I saw no safe way to stop (icy interstate with traffic, car in snowy median on a curve with no inside shoulder = way to dangerous to think about it).

Edited January 5, 2010 by RavEMTGun

[streethealer535]

I do not know if it is still true but at one time having a drivers license in Vermont imposed a duty to stop and render assistance to the best of your ability if you were the first uninvolved driver to find the wreck. That information is decades old and I can only hope that the state has changed it's rules to some more common sense approach.

Your pretty close... there are still 2 states in the union that are "Duty to Act" states. Vermont is one the other is Alaska. It is unlawfully to pass someone in need if you are a licensed provider in the state. That being said If you have a duty to someone else IE pt in an ambulance or child in car you do not have to stop. I have never heard of anyone losing a license or even being warned for not stopping.

Sadly this is not the first accident of the like in VT. I have personally been on four scenes were off duty police officers and FF have been injured due to vehicles hitting them or there vehicle on the side of the road. (luckily they all survived)

This is a tough decision to make... I know you feel obligated to help but at the same time is your life or your family's worth the risk?

~Street

[Richard B the EMT]

I do not know if it is still true but at one time having a drivers license in Vermont imposed a duty to stop and render assistance to the best of your ability if you were the first uninvolved driver to find the wreck.

While my brother, who is living in North Dakota, has not given me any update on it, I was told they have a similar law there.