EMS Providers Uniforms Substandard

[Arctickat]

I would like to know how many users feel Private EMS Providers Uniforms are Substandard.

I sense an "anti-private" undercurrent to this post. otherwise, why single out private operators? Personally, being part of a private operation, I can provide you with our uniform description as provided to all staff.

• 4 button down shirts
  
• 2 pair polyester pants
  
• 1 pair CSA approved boots
  
• Toque and summer cap
  
• NFPA 1999-2008 3:1 Summer/Winter jacket. (Globe Lifeline)
  
• NFPA 1999-2008 Pants. (Globe Lifeline)
  

Nothing too special about the first four items, save the protection offered by the boots, but when we got our Globe EMS gear I was surprised to see it had a 16 page user guide and a warning label on the clothing to read it. It is designed to protect he wearer from contamination by body fluids among other things.

[46Young]

Mandates. Similar to NFPA. Enforcement would have to be on the County or State Level. The enforcement issue is a problem in every industry in America. Employers try to cut corners if they know the cops are not around the corner. This may not be a problem everywhere. That is why I posted the topic. In my area I have seen EMT's show up in Tennis shoes with their shirts hanging out. But a more pressing issue is WHEN a disaster strikes. The Big Earthquake in California. I know Fire has stockpiles of PPE. But that is for them. Not for the BLS or ALS private provider.

I will use Hurricane Katrina for example, flight nurses were flying around in Levis and t-shirts, as there was not Pre-issued PPE. We talk allot about homeland security but we fail to address common short falls in the system. Yes the Military, the Fire Service ETC ETC. They did not show up during Katrina. Do you disagree?

FDNY EMS issues PPE to their EMT's and medics.

I sense an "anti-private" undercurrent to this post. otherwise, why single out private operators? Personally, being part of a private operation, I can provide you with our uniform description as provided to all staff.

• 4 button down shirts
• 2 pair polyester pants
• 1 pair CSA approved boots
• Toque and summer cap
• NFPA 1999-2008 3:1 Summer/Winter jacket. (Globe Lifeline)
• NFPA 1999-2008 Pants. (Globe Lifeline)

Nothing too special about the first four items, save the protection offered by the boots, but when we got our Globe EMS gear I was surprised to see it had a 16 page user guide and a warning label on the clothing to read it. It is designed to protect he wearer from contamination by body fluids among other things.

Too bad that many other private agencies go that far. You're lucky. Most places maybe provide polos or pants, but not both, forget about boots, and you need to actually purchase a coat from them if you don't want to freeze in the winter. Same goes for buing scopes, shears, penlights, even maps at some places.

I used to work here, and I think these uniforms look sharp and professional.

http://www.northshorelij.com/NSLIJ/Videos+CEMS

I like the large EMT or Paramedic patch on the shoulder. With some agencies you don't know what level they're at unless you ask, as there are no identifiers regarding cert level on their uniform. Also, we were sent to the tailor, the same one that does the NYPD, for our fittings. The materials were the same as the NYPD's. I left a couple of years ago, I assume that it's still the same.

[bajamedic]

I have worn turnouts to the point that avoid putting them on at all cost. I have been on the largest fires in the history of California. You guys are not getting it and that might be why we have a problem. <br><br>Are u willing to wear the gear you have been issued for a week, running 24 calls a day, day and night in a disaster zone. It seems a couple of you have an aversion to the Fire Service. The Fire Service runs the show in 80 percent of america when it comes to 911 EMS, and I see an aggressive take over of Private EMS by the Fire Service in the next few years due to budgets needing to be justified. Unified Fire in Salt lake has just about ran every company out. They do Medic Engine Transports. <br><br>The point is that Dickies style pants, Red Cap, Lyons, whatever.... are not appropriate clothing for long term EMS Operations. Look at England, and other countries. Look at the red cross in Spain and France. This was an issue during the world trade center 9/11. It was an issue during Katrina. Why not have a Standard Ensemble Outer Wear that could be adapted or modified for use by the user for cold wx or warm wx. Somewhat like Ski Patrol wears. Mandated by the DOT. Same Color and spec in every state. If a person saw you in San Diego or Miami it would be the same uniform. <br><br> I am not Ricky Rescue......it is your emergency not mine. I am not going to expose myself to the cold or heat or the rain, get my boots wet, get my shirt wet. Some of you have higher levels of medical training. OK.........why is it that you don't touch a sink with your scrubs when you wash your hands? Why is it that you don't allow soiled linen to touch your Scrubs? Why is it that you Don't allow Scrubs to be removed from the hospital, and why do they wash scrubs in a SEPARATED washing machine. The first code of the day, your uniform is contaminated, and you take back to the Quarters, it cross contaminates the Rig etc, etc. Then you put it in your washing machine at home where you wash you kids cloths. SICK......my sons mom never let me wash my uniform it the washing machine she said take it to the laundrymat. <br>Her mom was a trauma nurse, she knew about MRSA, and all the microbes and pathogens that remain. I challenge you to do some research on the subject. Now I feel the subject might be that EMS providers are not receiving the correct training, they don't understand what they are&nbsp;&nbsp;being exposed to. The first SNF you go into and kneel on the bed of a PT to lift them on the Gurney you have contaminated the crap out of your pants. <br>Then you go eat lunch in those pants, gross.<br><br>

<div><br></div><div>The globe stuff is right on point.....hats off to the FDNY EMS division. Ever run into Captain Morris from Rescue 1.?&nbsp;</div>

Edited February 8, 2010 by bajamedic

[JPINFV]

I have worn turnouts to the point that avoid putting them on at all cost. I have been on the largest fires in the history of California. You guys are not getting it and that might be why we have a problem. <br><br>Are u willing to wear the gear you have been issued for a week, running 24 calls a day, day and night in a disaster zone.

...because everyone is running 24 calls a day, day and night, in a disaster zone. Yep... that's it.

It seems a couple of you have an aversion to the Fire Service. The Fire Service runs the show in 80 percent of america when it comes to 911 EMS, and I see an aggressive take over of Private EMS by the Fire Service in the next few years due to budgets needing to be justified. Unified Fire in Salt lake has just about ran every company out. They do Medic Engine Transports.

The EMS based fire suppression only exists to appease the IAFF and provide jobs. There's a reason why California is one of the laughing stocks of American EMS. Heck, AMR in Riverside County is held to a higher standard clinically than the fire medics in Orange and Los Angeles Counties. Go figure that one out. They aren't reading the machine interpretation on their 12 leads like the fire medics in the neighboring counties are.

<br><br>The point is that Dickies style pants, Red Cap, Lyons, whatever.... are not appropriate clothing for long term EMS Operations. Look at England, and other countries. Look at the red cross in Spain and France. This was an issue during the world trade center 9/11. It was an issue during Katrina.

Yes... because a mini-Katrina or mini-9/11 occurs every day. Yep... that's it.

Why not have a Standard Ensemble Outer Wear that could be adapted or modified for use by the user for cold wx or warm wx. Somewhat like Ski Patrol wears. Mandated by the DOT. Same Color and spec in every state. If a person saw you in San Diego or Miami it would be the same uniform.

First off, are you seriously going to say that Alaska has similar climate issues to Hawaii? California to Maine? Texas to Washington? The big bulky company issue jacket I wore in MA (where, you know, it snows) is completely inappropriate to wear in Orange County, CA (where, you know, I can count the number of days with significant precipitation in a year on 2 hands). Second off, who's going to decide this? Do you understand what the 10th amendment says? Unlike HIPAA, I highly doubt that Medicare is going to want to play uniform cop.

I am not going to expose myself to the cold or heat or the rain, get my boots wet, get my shirt wet. Some of you have higher levels of medical training.

So if it's raining you refuse to respond? I hope no one gets sick in adverse weather where you live. After all, God forbid a single rain drop falls on your boot.

<div><br></div><div>The globe stuff is right on point.....hats off to the FDNY EMS division. Ever run into Captain Morris from Rescue 1.?&nbsp;</div>

[46Young]

I have worn turnouts to the point that avoid putting them on at all cost. I have been on the largest fires in the history of California. You guys are not getting it and that might be why we have a problem. <br><br>Are u willing to wear the gear you have been issued for a week, running 24 calls a day, day and night in a disaster zone. It seems a couple of you have an aversion to the Fire Service. The Fire Service runs the show in 80 percent of america when it comes to 911 EMS, and I see an aggressive take over of Private EMS by the Fire Service in the next few years due to budgets needing to be justified. Unified Fire in Salt lake has just about ran every company out. They do Medic Engine Transports. <br><br>The point is that Dickies style pants, Red Cap, Lyons, whatever.... are not appropriate clothing for long term EMS Operations. Look at England, and other countries. Look at the red cross in Spain and France. This was an issue during the world trade center 9/11. It was an issue during Katrina. Why not have a Standard Ensemble Outer Wear that could be adapted or modified for use by the user for cold wx or warm wx. Somewhat like Ski Patrol wears. Mandated by the DOT. Same Color and spec in every state. If a person saw you in San Diego or Miami it would be the same uniform. <br><br> I am not Ricky Rescue......it is your emergency not mine. I am not going to expose myself to the cold or heat or the rain, get my boots wet, get my shirt wet. Some of you have higher levels of medical training. OK.........why is it that you don't touch a sink with your scrubs when you wash your hands? Why is it that you don't allow soiled linen to touch your Scrubs? Why is it that you Don't allow Scrubs to be removed from the hospital, and why do they wash scrubs in a SEPARATED washing machine. The first code of the day, your uniform is contaminated, and you take back to the Quarters, it cross contaminates the Rig etc, etc. Then you put it in your washing machine at home where you wash you kids cloths. SICK......my sons mom never let me wash my uniform it the washing machine she said take it to the laundrymat. <br>Her mom was a trauma nurse, she knew about MRSA, and all the microbes and pathogens that remain. I challenge you to do some research on the subject. Now I feel the subject might be that EMS providers are not receiving the correct training, they don't understand what they are&nbsp;&nbsp;being exposed to. The first SNF you go into and kneel on the bed of a PT to lift them on the Gurney you have contaminated the crap out of your pants. <br>Then you go eat lunch in those pants, gross.<br><br>

<div><br></div><div>The globe stuff is right on point.....hats off to the FDNY EMS division. Ever run into Captain Morris from Rescue 1.?&nbsp;</div>

Like JPINFV said, different regions experience different weather issues. Being out in the field for a week straight or whatever should have been in your job description. It's something you should've taken into consideration before taking the job. You don't want to deal with the cold, heat, rain, wet boots and wet shirt? Cry me a river. Try doing an interior attack straight from PT where you're dehydrated and wet, getting soaked, coming out to temps in the teens, rehabbing for 20 minutes and then doing several rounds of overhaul in soaking wet bunker gear. 5 hours of fun or more. Then reracking hose out in the elements while in the same gear. I changed my hood and my socks. But I don't whine about it.

We run in Northern Virginia, where we're subject to a full range of climate conditions. I've worked both suppression and EMS in 100 degree plus humid heat, and I've worked for 48 hours straight through two blizzards here, one for 19 inches and one where we just got two feet. I rode the ambulance exclusively during both events. We get the occasional hurricane and airplane crashing into buildings as well (Pentagon, remember?) But no one here whines about it.

For comparison's sake, we're issued two sets of structural gear, one Scott facepiece, four pairs of nomex pants, three short sleeve polos and three long sleeve, three short sleeve uniform shirts and three long sleeve, a pair of work boots, hat, one pair of coveralls, and one half length coat.

Now, if we get our gear contaminated with BBP, we send it in to be cleaned. When I used to work hospital based EMS, the same place as in the video link above, we were advised to red bag any clothing that couldn't be decon'ed with hydrogen peroxide, and to take it to the dry cleaners. Only a reTARD would try and wash them at home. Oh, and we were all given the BBP/infectious control lecture at orientation as well as EMT school and also paramedic school. Everyone also knows not to kneel down into any mystery puddles. It's called common sense. When I worked NYC 911, we could be outside for a fire 75/MCI 22 for several hours in single digit temps, and also lengthy cut jobs, in only a uniform, turtleneck, coat, and a perp hat (skully).

If you can't hack it out in the elements, perhaps it's time for a new career. Or carry several changes of clothes with you. In the unlikely event that numerous pts vomit, bleed, and smear feces on you, forcing you to run through four to five uniforms or whatever, thern put yourself out of service due to BBP contamination. Those in the FDNY EMS system do it all the time, go OOS BBP. If your employer expects you to work in contaminated gear, then work somewhere else, preferably where it's always 70 degrees and sunny, with light winds, where it only rains when you're off duty.

Anyway, you're not suppression, you're EMS. I find it hard to believe that you're doing one week tours or whatever. I've haven't heard of EMS working more that 48 to 72 straight. Four uniforms plus a pair of coveralls should suffice for BBP issues.

Edited February 8, 2010 by 46Young

[Guest GorhamNHEMTI]

Mandates. Similar to NFPA. Enforcement would have to be on the County or State Level. The enforcement issue is a problem in every industry in America. Employers try to cut corners if they know the cops are not around the corner. This may not be a problem everywhere. That is why I posted the topic. In my area I have seen EMT's show up in Tennis shoes with their shirts hanging out. But a more pressing issue is WHEN a disaster strikes. The Big Earthquake in California. I know Fire has stockpiles of PPE. But that is for them. Not for the BLS or ALS private provider.

I will use Hurricane Katrina for example, flight nurses were flying around in Levis and t-shirts, as there was not Pre-issued PPE. We talk allot about homeland security but we fail to address common short falls in the system. Yes the Military, the Fire Service ETC ETC. They did not show up during Katrina. Do you disagree?

The military and fire services were there, did you watch the news at all. Also Homeland Security grants are mostly for the municiple/county/state and not for private for profit companies. Homeland Security grants help municiple departments, without raising taxes. For profit companies if they want to have extra gear can raise their rates. Where I come from our third service EMS can not just raise our rates, we have to go before the board of selectman.

[Siffaliss]

In my area I have seen EMT's show up in Tennis shoes with their shirts hanging out.

Personally, I think that's just sloppy and perhaps laziness on the part of the EMT's dressing themselves like that. It's not a fashion show, however some care has to be taken in our appearance as we are after all in the public eye. We should look professional.

As for services that require employees to buy their own uniforms ... I wish there was a way around this. I've worked for places that dictated this and it got expensive, especially when the wages weren't all that great. Fortunately, basic uniforms/jackets/boots/safety gear are provided to me now. As for anything extra such as insulating winter clothing etc etc, we are responsible for that ourselves. There is however a way to tax deduct that stuff ...

[crotchitymedic1986]

Here are a couple of thoughts:

1. I have a friend who works at a bank, and is required to wear a suit to work. He makes about $30k, and his suits are $200-500.00 each, and he has to have enough to make it through a 5 day week. His employer does not contribute towards his clothing.

2. I have a friend who is a Nurse, she makes over $40k/year and her employer mandates that she wears a certain color scrub uniform. Although she makes more than friend 1, she still is not reimbursed for clothing.

Be happy that someone buys your clothes for you. Better than that, be happy you have a job.

[JPINFV]

2. I have a friend who is a Nurse, she makes over $40k/year and her employer mandates that she wears a certain color scrub uniform. Although she makes more than friend 1, she still is not reimbursed for clothing.

...and if she works at multiple hospitals then she might have to have multiple sets of different color scrubs. Not all scrub color codes are the same from hospital to hospital.

[spenac]

...and if she works at multiple hospitals then she might have to have multiple sets of different color scrubs. Not all scrub color codes are the same from hospital to hospital.

And some hospitals provide scrubs.

So really no different than EMS some pay some don't.