AED: For Trained Responders Only---nooooo

[donedeal]

I recently started a new part time contract gig at a health department/EMS agency. The office complex is pretty big, consisting of 4 buildings, one of which is EMS headquarters. Throughout the entire complex there are AEDs on various floors, offices, the community gym, ect. On all of the glassed wall boxes that contain the AED, is the label: "For Trained Responders Only"---pretty big and bold, can't be missed.

To me this completely defeats the purpose of having an AED in a public place. IMO, the AED is a stop gap measure to be used by civilians prior to arrival of trained responders (who will be bringing an AED anyways). Am I wrong? I'm inclined to bring this up at a senior staff meeting, but don't want to rock the boat since I'm new, and technically not even an employee. What do you all think, is this common practice?

[Chief1C]

That doesn't mean it's there for EMS. It means it's there for First Aid/CPR/AED trained employees to deploy.

[Richard B the EMT]

Continuing on the comment by 4c6, I might be in another state, credentials not accepted, but I don't think anyone would object if, when needed, I were the one opening the wall storage box, and applying the pads to a needing person, especially if nobody else knows how.

Find out if the agency has training programs available for "civilian" usage of the AEDs, and if you have the contacts, help arrange for it for anyone who wants it.

[P_Instructor]

On all of the glassed wall boxes that contain the AED, is the label: "For Trained Responders Only"---pretty big and bold, can't be missed.

Check to see if by opening the 'box' there is an alarm activated so that 'trained' responders will go to the scene of the event. If not, this could be another way to make sure trained personnel are on scene. Most AEDs are 'follow the directions', but if not trained, things still may be messed up. Either way, something is being done for the patient.

[HERBIE1]

To me, this warning reminds me of the product warning labels like "Don't use hairdryer in bathtub." I think it's simply something a lawyer/risk assessment person said was required. Since you cannot accidently shock someone with an AED, I think these warnings are silly.

[Lone Star]

The reasonably intelligent person would presume that "For Trained Responders Only" means "Don't mess with this if you don't know what you're doing". Obviously, if you're trained and certified in the use of the AED, you're more than welcome to get into this case if you need what's in it.

"For Trained Responders Only" doesn't mean "If you're not in EMS, keep your hands off!".

The general public's mentality seems to be along the lines of, "I saw this on TV, so it can't be that hard to use.", and unfortunately, the AED is a lifesaving tool, not a toy. Improper placement/use, will lead to disasterous results.

Hell, even those 'trained responders' can't be counted on to use it properly! Just look at that EMT in Virginia who was convicted on involuntary manslaughter charges because he was 'playing' with a manual defibrillator! ( http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-01-24-emt-killing_x.htm ) He ended up killing his partner. If the "Trained Responders Only" can't be counted on not to play with a defibrillator, how in the hell can we expect the general public not to play with them?

[Richard B the EMT]

If the "Trained Responders Only" can't be counted on not to play with a defibrillator, how in the hell can we expect the general public not to play with them?

Well, there is that alarm on the glass wall mount box, that sounds off when the box is opened...

[DwayneEMTP]

...To me this completely defeats the purpose of having an AED in a public place. IMO, the AED is a stop gap measure to be used by civilians prior to arrival of trained responders (who will be bringing an AED anyways)...

I agree with you completely. The reason for the AEDs being almost completely foolproof is so that it is an adjunct to CPR. You don't have to be well trained to provide half assed CPR and you really don't need any training at all to use an AED. And we know, we're not guessing, but know, that the AED is what's going to save most of these folks, right?

Unless you're company has a process in place that trains each new hire in the building immediately upon arrival in CPR and AED usage, then I'm completley on board with you. To put a sign on the box that is basically saying, "If you haven't been trained in the use of this 'no training necessary' device then please stand by quietly while the few critical seconds available to save this arrest patient tick away. Thank you for your support."

I think you're right on track with your thinking and that a change is prudent and responsible.

Dwayne

[Kiwiology]

I agree with you completely.

And I agree with you! LOL

I am trying to think if when I was working in the US our AEDs said that; I am pretty sure they did because I can remember being given the mandatory "training" despite the fact nobody could figure out why we had to be "trained" on something a layperson can friggin use!

May be worth checking the Good Samaritan Laws in <your state here>. To continue in English, press one, Para el español desfibrilador externo automatizado de instrucciones, pulse dos.

From my understanding <your state here> will probably have a law saying those who use an AED (like giving first aid) are to be held harmless if they toast you incorrectly (pretty impossible to do, but still)

[Eydawn]

This is a workplace liability issue. Anywhere that has these signs has designated employees who have been trained as CPR/AED responders at company expense and they are responsible for getting to the patient and using the AED's. It doesn't mean that nobody else can use them, what it really means is that the company has provisions in place and is now covered if Larry the Mail Room R-Tard (thinking Larry the Cable Guy here) goes for the AED and uses it, the company's not liable if he fries himself or someone else. This is exactly how it works at my hubby's workplace, and he is one of the AED/CPR responders there.

Wendy

CO EMT-B