Involuntary Consent?

[speedygodzilla]

Thanks all for your help. I am not too worried about being sued, but how would I answer this question if it popped up on my NREMT-P test which I hope to take soon. I am now going to go with involuntary consent even thought I really don't like that answer.

I see it more as implied consent seeing that the patient is not in the right mental form to make proper decisions on their care.

One book says one thing, and another says another yet the NREMT doesn't seem to have a source that I can rely solely on for testing so I stuck picking what I think is the "best answer."

Oh joy!

[ccmedoc]

Thanks all for your help. I am not too worried about being sued, but how would I answer this question if it popped up on my NREMT-P test which I hope to take soon. I am now going to go with involuntary consent even thought I really don't like that answer.

I see it more as implied consent seeing that the patient is not in the right mental form to make proper decisions on their care.

One book says one thing, and another says another yet the NREMT doesn't seem to have a source that I can rely solely on for testing so I stuck picking what I think is the "best answer."

Oh joy!

likely you wont see the question. I take this test every two years, and I just took CBT again last month for the fifth time. I have never had a question this vague. They would probably ask you about the unconscious patient in an emergency situation and give you implied as an option.

I did see more lab value questions on this last exam, as well as antidote and reversal agent questions..Very few legal questions...

The difference in the scenario you provided was LEO and the fact that the patient was combative and needed to be restrained for his and others safety. This is the difference between implied and involuntary. Implied assumes that under normal circumstances, the person would consent to treatment needed...Involuntary is just that..I do agree that the word "consent" is a bit misplaced in the term..

[Richard B the EMT]

Putting my protocols up against everyone else's, there is usually consent,

1) Informed Consent, where the patient understands everything, including worst case scenarios if they were to decline treatment and/or transportation, up to and including them dying,

2) Implied Consent, where the patient is unable to communicate their wishes to be treated and transported, but the crew believes and acts as though the patient did understand, as per item #1 in this posting. For a minor aged patient, it is implied the youth's parent, guardian, or caretaker would want the child be treated and transported.

If a patient seems to not want treatment or transportation, as a person deemed to be "Alert and Oriented times 3" (times 4 in some jurisdictions) would be, and it is suspected the person is in some altered mental status (drugs, dementia, psychosis), as I already stated, the LEOs, acting on behalf of the suspected AMS person, will step in and "grant permission" to the crew to treat and/or transport.

[ilinmedic205]

Instead of "Involuntary consent" what ever happened to protective custody, the EMT or Paramedic deems the pt. is a threat to self or others and has the local PD take pt. into protective custody to treat pt. Or where I work we do EDO's (Emergency Detention Orders) that are filled out by the local PD.