Deputies Handcuff Fire Captain Trying to Aid Woman

[Kiwiology]

Sounds kind of screwey, you leave a scence where you aren't needed and get threatened with jail WTF?

I think the cop had it right to tell the Fire Department they were not required as the ambulance crew was already treating the patient

A bunch of more emergency personnel standing round doing nothing wouldn't help the situation any.

[Dustdevil]

But fire union officials said the plan to have one person do both jobs – known as a “public safety officer” -- "has been widely discredited and has failed in communities throughout North America because of the difficulty training one person to do such diverse jobs."

ROFL! Funny, you never hear them say that when they are trying to take over EMS. Hypocritical bastards.

[brentoli]

I think the cop had it right to tell the Fire Department they were not required as the ambulance crew was already treating the patient

Even though the ambulance crew was requesting their help?

[Kiwiology]

...Deputy Steve James wanted to keep the fire EMTs outside, because the ambulance crew was already inside caring for the woman and he didn't want to crowd the upset patient.

"The deputy (James) who had the ambulance team on scene ... was of the opinion that there were enough personnel on the scene and that the addition of the three firemen would serve no purpose other than to further upset the victim and her children," the sheriff's office statement said. Deputies told the fire crew "they were not needed."

Seems reasonable!

Finally, deputies told firefighters if they didn't leave, they would be arrested.

Sounds like the Fire Service hung around long enough to make a turd of themselves and get told to leave or be canned

"I never thought I would be in jail, with handcuffs on for trying to take care of a patient," Dailey told the Herald Democrat. "I took an oath to protect the community and its citizens. I was doing that to the best of my ability, and my freedoms were taken away because of it."

I appreciate what he is saying, but when he doesn't listen to being asked to leave doesn't that seem to register with this guy?

He also says it in the typical pro-fire way that the Fire Service seems to be good at; I don't hear the Ambulance Service out there going on about "thier oath to protect the community". This is all very publicity, bright lights and making things look good for the Fire Service, the IAFF would be proud!

By showing up on a scene without being dispatched, firefighters "disregard our authority and abilities," Sheriff Holte told the local newspaper. "It's like a slap in the face."

I agree! Sticking your beek in where it does not belong!!

"This is what we're all about is being there to render aid, to assist and care," Harvey said. "So this could have been more appropriately handled had my crew been allowed to begin the basic life support and stabilization procedures on this patient. And then taken care of (the jurisdictional dispute) later."

I don't see how oxygen and taking a blood pressure would help? It doesn't sound like this patient was critically sick

Firefighters are vowing a protest rally Monday.

Why, because they poked thier nose in where it did not belong and got it bit?

“Preventing a first responder from administering care to a victim is unforgivable," International Association of Fire Fighters 9th District Vice President Randy Atkinson said in a statement. "The Lake County Sheriff’s Department should issue an immediate apology to the victim and to the Leadville Fire Department, and the deputy whose terrible judgment led him to arrest Captain Dailey should step down because he is unfit to serve the public."

Oh FFS what a lot of bullshit. Good to see the local IAFF man had to step in and make the fire service look like the victim.

"This frontier justice is an abuse of power,” Atkinson added. "The sheriff’s department is free to disagree with us, but he is not free to arrest those who disagree with him."

No, but he is legally able to arrest those who do not comply with his requests!

But fire union officials said the plan to have one person do both jobs – known as a “public safety officer” -- "has been widely discredited and has failed in communities throughout North America because of the difficulty training one person to do such diverse jobs."

Sounds like they should look in thier own backyard before condemming others!

Even though the ambulance crew was requesting their help?

It seems to be local protocol to send Firefighers as "first response". The Deputy decided that he did not think the firefighters were needed which may have been for any of the following or other reaosns unbeknown to us (we aren't the cop)

1) the transport ambulance was either there or coming, and the firefighters could not transport,

2) the patient was not critically sick,

3) three firefighters on scene in addition to the two ambulance officers who were already there, or coming, would be execssive,

4) the ambulance officers may have been able to provide a higher level of care than the BLS firefighters,

Then it seems the Firefighters hung around long enough to create a bad smell despite being asked to leave that the cop said he would arrest them, the Fire Captain in his "last stand" mentality said he did not want to leave a medical scene, where at that time he was not needed.

Does it not register with this guy that (at the particular time he was told, future circumstances notwithstanding) if he was not needed why would you hang around somewhere you weren't needed to the point that you were told to leave or be arrested? Why on earth would you stay somewhere you weren't needed?

[brentoli]

However during an interview Thursday afternoon with 7News, the sheriff said, "the fire department was in the building first, the ambulance [team] was in the building second."

Quit trying to spin the article and ignore the parts that don't agree with what you are saying.

I still don't understand how you keep missing the part where THE AMBULANCE CREW REQUESTED ASSISTANCE FROM THE FIRE DEPARTMENT ON SCENE.

[Dustdevil]

The SO changing their story TWICE about who arrived first is going to bite their credibility in the arse. Don't expect any charges from the DA, and DO expect some flack from the county commissioners over it. This is embarrassing to the county.

Of course, I lost all faith in Colorado sheriff's back during the Balloon Boy debacle. Idiots.

[Kiwiology]

I still don't understand how you keep missing the part where THE AMBULANCE CREW REQUESTED ASSISTANCE FROM THE FIRE DEPARTMENT ON SCENE.

It seems to be local protocol to send Firefighers as "first response". The Deputy decided that he did not think the firefighters were needed despite this however it seems the Firefighters hung around long enough to create a bad smell despite being asked to leave that the cop said he would arrest them, the Fire Captain in his "last stand" mentality said he did not want to leave a medical scene, where at that time he was not needed.

Does it not register with this guy that (at the particular time he was told, future circumstances notwithstanding) if he was not needed why would you hang around somewhere you weren't needed to the point that you were told to leave or be arrested? Why on earth would you stay somewhere you weren't needed?

The fact that the Ambulance Officers requested the help of the firefighters after the crux of the issue had gone down is of no bearing whatsoever.

So what if they needed help at some point after this had taken place? The mentality of the Firefighters is that they would not leave when at that time, they were not needed! They obviously hung around long enough to create a stink that the cop felt he had to challenge them to leave or be arrested.

The point here is the firefighters did not want to leave when they were (at that time) clearly of no use.

[Dustdevil]

It is not the cops' duty or prerogative to decide if the firemonkeys are needed or not. It is the duty of the medical authority at the scene, being the ambulance crew. If the ambulance crew is not yet on the scene -- which is what it sounds like -- then the cop absolutely has no duty or authority to disregard the first responders.

I agree that a cop should be fired here.

[Kiwiology]

It is not the cops' duty or prerogative to decide if the firemonkeys are needed or not. It is the duty of the medical authority at the scene, being the ambulance crew. If the ambulance crew is not yet on the scene -- which is what it sounds like -- then the cop absolutely has no duty or authority to disregard the first responders.

I agree that a cop should be fired here.

I don't understand how your system works with regard to who is in charge where and whether the cops can stand down the fire department Technicians or not so I won't comment there.

It sounds like the transporting ambulance crew showed up (or were already there) and did thier thing but the Firefighters hung around long enough where they were not needed (because the transporting crew was dealing with the patient) to cause a stink with this particular Officer.

Again, if the transporting crew were doing thier thing, the Firefighters were (at that time) clearly no use so why hang round where you are not needed????

[scubanurse]

Ben... I seriously think you need to re-read that article. It sounds like the firefighters arrived first, fairly common in a lot of areas not just in CO, and the cops decided not to let them evaluate the patient. Who are they to turn away trained EMS providers? They are on the scene as Law Enforcement Officers NOT EMS. The firefighters should have been allowed to evaluate the patient and decide if they were needed or not...NOT the LEO's.

Now, if the ambulance was already on scene, then the LEO's should have still allowed the fire captain (not the entire crew) to enter the scene and speak with the medical officer in charge to see if their services were needed...and from the article, their services were in fact needed.

This was way out of line and should not have been handled the way it was on scene, but rather back at the station between supervising officers, not the personnel in the field as this matter extends way beyond the field and into the bureaucratic nightmare.

The arresting officer should be placed on administrative leave pending a further investigation into charges of hindering a 911 call and potentially a false arrest.

I would believe that the fire officer has some grounds in civil court against the arresting officer pending the outcome of the investigation.

This situation was handled so poorly it is embarrassing. Politics should NEVER get in the way of providing patient care and in this case, it seems that it did.

It seems the article was updated, the patient suffered a broken neck... I would think that a 2-man EMS crew would need all the help they can get to properly backboard and secure the c-spine in this case.

And it states again, that the EMS crew did in fact transport but not after needing to call back the 2 other firefighters who were sent off by the cops. So how are the LEO's right here?? They cleared the fire crew without first checking with the treating medical team?? Since when did LEO's become the bouncers of calls? If anything, they shouldn't be inside because their presence alone can upset a domestic violence victim even more, not really the presence of a trained medical crew.

Ugh this situation just rubs me the wrong way, and Kiwi... They were needed... so you statement of

Again, if the transporting crew were doing thier thing, the Firefighters were (at that time) clearly no use so why hang round where you are not needed????

is false. You "hang round" until the EMS crew clears you not some

fired volunteer firefighter who is training members of the sheriff’s department to become firefighters

(from the article). Edited April 3, 2010 by scoobykate