Taking Vitals

[BlissEMT]

Tomorrow, I have a meeting with HR over an unrelated issue. I think I am going to bring up the fact that i worked with a partner who didn't take vitals, and see where it goes from there.

That's a good idea. Bring it up and see what they say.

Personally, I would say you absolutely need to report him for this. The PCRs become part of the medical record (here at least) and medical records are legal documents. Falsifying it can equal the same punishment, if not worse (plus lawsuit possibilities) as falsifying a police report or court document. And if you're 'allowing' it to happen, you could be held responsible for aiding him in writing false reports. Of course, that's worse-case scenario.

Not trying to say you are doing anything wrong, but I just wouldn't want you to get in trouble for not standing up for yourself, because you're nervous about being the 'newbie pest'.

[CBEMT]

I don't know about your location, but here each provider has a license and the same level of training, which means you are equally responsible for the info contained in that report. Thus, each of you is supposed to sign each report.

As providers, you are both responsible for patient care.

Whether I have the same license as my partner or nor isn't really material. If I drive and my partner (Basic for the sake of argument) techs, and on the way to the hospital he performs a thoracotomy, that's on him. Many people drive trucks that they can't even see their partners in during transport- not that they should be taking their eyes off the road/mirrors anyway.

But since we're talking about paperwork- everybody's name goes onto ours a matter of record, EMT numbers on the bubble side that goes to the state, but mine's the only signature, or my partner's, or whoever (if we happen to be running with a 3rd that day). If I teched and my partner drove, there's probably 2-3 sets of vitals and whatever treatments I provide to document, that my partner had zero to do with. And vice versa if the roles were reversed.

If I ignore protocol and throw the patient a nitro with a BP of 80, my driver/partner is no more responsible for that than the hospital janitor.

[JHarbeson]

First, report him to your supervisor. Second, Report him to yu medical director and third, report him to you state certification/licensing board. This man SHOULD NOT be in this business if since he REFUSES to do the job correctly. He is compromising patient safety and life at all cost and it will come to bite him and you in the butt.

It is your responsibility to report him. I would in a heart beat and if your supervisor doesn't like it, then find another job as that says the company is fine with your partners actions and they need to be shut down.

Asinine agencies and EMT/Paramedics are popping up everywhere!!

[tskstorm]

First, report him to your supervisor. Second, Report him to yu medical director and third, report him to you state certification/licensing board. This man SHOULD NOT be in this business if since he REFUSES to do the job correctly. He is compromising patient safety and life at all cost and it will come to bite him and you in the butt.

It is your responsibility to report him. I would in a heart beat and if your supervisor doesn't like it, then find another job as that says the company is fine with your partners actions and they need to be shut down.

Asinine agencies and EMT/Paramedics are popping up everywhere!!

Good first post, welcome to the city.

[+medic]

Plus he doesn't have a license. Afraid to ask why not.

Ummmm wow I wonder what happend?

If I were you I would CMY as much as I can. If things go wrong he could take you down with him. Vitals are the most basic part of what we do in EMS. In my opinion if your not doing them well or even at all then you should not be put in charge of a patient.

Back to Basics I say or just slap him.

[Just Plain Ruff]

First some backround:

I have recently started a new job, about a month ago. I will be working with the critical care transport team out of the local children's hospital. But since I haven't driven before, and I will be required to drive halfway, I am down at the company's corporate office getting some driving practice. Right now I am doing mostly interfacility transports, which I have not done before. I do have some 911 experience.

Now here is my problem:

I have worked with this same partner for 4 shifts now. After we load the patient, I usually shut the doors, he gets in, I get up front and start the truck. Put on my seat belt, and ask him if he is ready to go. I do this because I know some people prefer to get some of the paperwork and vitals out of the way before getting underway. From the beginning, he told me that I do not need to wait, that he is fine to do it while I am driving. Yesterday, After an extremely busy day of 7 back to back calls, we got a call to the NH that we were just leaving, to take a pt to the ER, emergency, no L&S, for hypotension. Upon arrival, the nurse stated that the patient had been having hypotension for about an hour, first BP being 90/50. Thirty Minutes later, it was 85/50. The patient stated she had been nauseas earlier in the day, and was feeling flushed now.

When we arrived at the hospital, The charge nurse asked what her BP was on the way. My partner stated it was 100/50. The nurse said, oh good it came up, and walked away. My partner asked for her signature, gave her the paperwork, and she walked away. After the call, as we were making up the stretcher, he made a comment about the call being BS anyway, and it began a conversation that really disgusted me. He hadn't taken the patient's BP, or any vitals, nor does he ever take any vitals. He makes them up on the state forms, and he had lied to the nurse about the pt's bp. I was really upset. I asked him to explain himself, and he said its just a transport its not really important to take vitals, and he can't hear with all the noise. When I pointed out that i always give him the opportunity to do them before taking off, he just shrugged his shoulders and walked away.

I feel that what he is doing is wrong. I am just not sure what to do. Do i report this to a supervisor? I am afraid to make a big stink of this, as I don't want to be seen as the new girl that comes in and causes a ruckus. But I also want to make sure that my partner isn't compromising patient care!

Some advice please!

YOU REPORT THIS NUFF SAID

It's your licensure too, you are on the report also. If you do not report it you give tacit approval that this medic can falsify a patient run report. If it goes to court and you say you didn't report this then you are on the hook for the jury award and that does not look good.

screw being the new person, there are just some things that you do not allow or let go on. Falsifying medical records is one of them

I worked for a big company a number of years ago and got called into the supervisors office. I was told to re-write several reports I had written because that big company was not gonna get paid. I put down the patient walked to the cot yet the company wanted me to write that I had to lift the patient via sheets to the cot. That way they would get paid. I refused and I was threatened with termination. I said do what you have to do. They did not make me re-write them. They didn't fire me but I was deemed a trouble maker and was given my walking papers a couple of weeks later.

I went to medicare about it. Not sure what happened but my conscience was clear.

So stand your ground and report it. This is a prime example of a lazy ass provider who shouldn't be working in EMS. What else does he not do. The possiblities are endless and very very frightening.

[snoopy911]

YOU REPORT THIS NUFF SAID

It's your licensure too, you are on the report also. If you do not report it you give tacit approval that this medic can falsify a patient run report. If it goes to court and you say you didn't report this then you are on the hook for the jury award and that does not look good.

screw being the new person, there are just some things that you do not allow or let go on. Falsifying medical records is one of them

I worked for a big company a number of years ago and got called into the supervisors office. I was told to re-write several reports I had written because that big company was not gonna get paid. I put down the patient walked to the cot yet the company wanted me to write that I had to lift the patient via sheets to the cot. That way they would get paid. I refused and I was threatened with termination. I said do what you have to do. They did not make me re-write them. They didn't fire me but I was deemed a trouble maker and was given my walking papers a couple of weeks later.

I went to medicare about it. Not sure what happened but my conscience was clear.

So stand your ground and report it. This is a prime example of a lazy ass provider who shouldn't be working in EMS. What else does he not do. The possiblities are endless and very very frightening.

Great post Ruff.

I will fill you guys in on what has gone on since I wrote this first post. This whole thing has blown up in my face, and may end up being a much bigger deal then I ever dreamed.

I reported to my supervisor about this whole business about taking vitals, and a few days later I was told I had to have a meeting with HR on what they told me was a unrelated issue. Apparently, it was not an unrelated issue. When they had asked my partner about whether or not he took vitals, he told them that I probably only said that because he told me that I was an unsafe driver. He reported to them that He felt unsafe with me driving. This only came out after I reported him for not taking vitals. He never said anything to me about my driving, and I have had no complaints from any of the other people I have worked with, and I have even had compliments from patients. I have had no accidents, haven't hit anything, ran any lights or broken any laws, not even hit a curb.

But apparently at this company, driving liability trumps patient care, and I am suspended from the drivers list for 6 months, no questions asked. As far as I know, there has been no disciplinary action towards my partner. I am still shocked by this whole thing. I was told that I can continue to work there, as the attendant, and in 6 months I can petition to have my driving privledges reinstated. I have decided that I can no longer be employed there. Part of this decision because it is a really long commute, and I will no longer be able to be transferred to where they promised. The other part is because I refuse to be associated with a company that will stand for this. As far as I know, they didn't take my claims of my partner not taking vitals nearly as seriously as they took me "being a bad driver". All this happened Friday so I am still processing it all, but I believe I may have to take this issue further. I am really disapointed in how this whole situation is turning out.

I apologize for the long drawn out run on sentences, as this whole situation is touchy for me and makes my grammar go out the window.

[Just Plain Ruff]

Great post Ruff.

I will fill you guys in on what has gone on since I wrote this first post. This whole thing has blown up in my face, and may end up being a much bigger deal then I ever dreamed.

I reported to my supervisor about this whole business about taking vitals, and a few days later I was told I had to have a meeting with HR on what they told me was a unrelated issue. Apparently, it was not an unrelated issue. When they had asked my partner about whether or not he took vitals, he told them that I probably only said that because he told me that I was an unsafe driver. He reported to them that He felt unsafe with me driving. This only came out after I reported him for not taking vitals. He never said anything to me about my driving, and I have had no complaints from any of the other people I have worked with, and I have even had compliments from patients. I have had no accidents, haven't hit anything, ran any lights or broken any laws, not even hit a curb.

But apparently at this company, driving liability trumps patient care, and I am suspended from the drivers list for 6 months, no questions asked. As far as I know, there has been no disciplinary action towards my partner. I am still shocked by this whole thing. I was told that I can continue to work there, as the attendant, and in 6 months I can petition to have my driving privledges reinstated. I have decided that I can no longer be employed there. Part of this decision because it is a really long commute, and I will no longer be able to be transferred to where they promised. The other part is because I refuse to be associated with a company that will stand for this. As far as I know, they didn't take my claims of my partner not taking vitals nearly as seriously as they took me "being a bad driver". All this happened Friday so I am still processing it all, but I believe I may have to take this issue further. I am really disapointed in how this whole situation is turning out.

I apologize for the long drawn out run on sentences, as this whole situation is touchy for me and makes my grammar go out the window.

Ok, you are screwed but here are a couple of things that you can do to make sure that what is happening may stop

1. Call your service's medical director, list out what happened like you told us and that you feel you are being ramrodded out because they feel that driving trumps patient care. Be careful to make sure you have documented patient names and info on certain calls on when this dumbtard didn't take vitals, especially the one with the low bp that he didn't take.

2. Call Medicare and let them know about the fraudulent medical charting and fraudulent billing. they will take a active interest in this case.

3. Let them fire you, don't quit or you cannot get unemployment and then just soak it up. (I don't advocate being a drain on society)

4. count your blessings you learned quickly that this service SUCKS Donkey balls.

[snoopy911]

Ok, you are screwed but here are a couple of things that you can do to make sure that what is happening may stop

1. Call your service's medical director, list out what happened like you told us and that you feel you are being ramrodded out because they feel that driving trumps patient care. Be careful to make sure you have documented patient names and info on certain calls on when this dumbtard didn't take vitals, especially the one with the low bp that he didn't take.

2. Call Medicare and let them know about the fraudulent medical charting and fraudulent billing. they will take a active interest in this case.

3. Let them fire you, don't quit or you cannot get unemployment and then just soak it up. (I don't advocate being a drain on society)

4. count your blessings you learned quickly that this service SUCKS Donkey balls.

1.Maybe this is a stupid question, but I have no idea how to get a hold of my service's medical director. Being a basic, I haven't had any experience with medical control. Also, I don't remember patient names, but if i saw the paperwork I could identify it. We did a lot of calls that day that i discovered he was faking vitals.

3. Well I don't think I am being fired. They told me I can stay on as an EMT. I have to stay on until I find other employment, since i was hurt for close to 15 months and not working, and I need the paycheck. But i really don't want to work for this company, if this is how they respond to this type of stuff. I am really unsure of what to do right now.

4. Yup I have already figured that out! I have been employed around a month with this company. It is a company of about 480 employees. You would think they would take things like this seriously. Apparently not. Donkey balls, I AGREE!

[tskstorm]

1.Maybe this is a stupid question, but I have no idea how to get a hold of my service's medical director. Being a basic, I haven't had any experience with medical control. Also, I don't remember patient names, but if i saw the paperwork I could identify it. We did a lot of calls that day that i discovered he was faking vitals.

Going to be different everywhere you work. Ask a supervisor how to get in touch with the med director.