Mass. EMTs: Punishment for Fake Certification Is Unfair

[emtannie]

http://www.emsresponder.com/article/article.jsp?id=13846&siteSection=1

A quote from the article:

"Beginning July 1, more than 200 emergency medical technicians will not be making emergency calls. They've been suspended for anywhere from 45 days to nine months for falsely claiming they took certification refresher courses.

The state said it came down hard to send a message and protect public safety, but two EMTs said the move is unfair and dangerous.

Kim is a state emergency technician. She's been suspended for nine months for allegedly falsifying certification class attendance. She says if she broke the law, she should be punished.

"But a nine-month suspension? I've lost my job and my health insurance. I don't now what I am going to do," said Kim.

She said the harsh punishment of EMTs is unfair, especially because she believes the refresher courses they're required to take have no bearing on competence and knowledge."

OK, if I understand this right, those EMT's FALSELY claimed they took the required refresher courses, but even though they did not complete their competencies, and they LIED, the don't feel they should be punished????? Wow.. that is a little scary - I suspect the EMT's who feel that way were raised with the "oh it's ok, honey, everyone does bad things, and it isn't really your fault" generation.

What ever happened to there being consequences for your actions?

And the part about the refresher courses having no bearing on competence or knowledge? Yeah, taking your CPR every year is a PITA, but there is a valid reason for refreshers. I don't care what competencies they missed, there is a reason we take refreshers.

It appears that the EMT's involved in this knew that they were not following the rules, and yet they want the state to turn a blind eye to it. Regardless of whether they think those classes are relevant or not, this is not the route to take to make changes. Since it appears they truly knew that they were outside of the rules, I have no problem with the consequences.

[Lone Star]

Kim is a state emergency technician. She's been suspended for nine months for allegedly falsifying certification class attendance. She says if she broke the law, she should be punished.

"But a nine-month suspension? I've lost my job and my health insurance. I don't now what I am going to do," said Kim.

She said the harsh punishment of EMTs is unfair, especially because she believes the refresher courses they're required to take have no bearing on competence and knowledge."

She admits that she should be punished. What does she consider an 'appropriate punishment' in this case? We're talking about people's lives in her hands.

As far as the refresher courses having 'no bearing on competence and knowledge', just what does she think these refresher courses are for?

How many times have we taken a CPR refresher course, only to find that the AHA (or similar agency) has changed the guidelines? Look at how many times the compression to breath ratio alone has been changed!

When I first started they had just changed from using one hand to 'scoop the back of the neck' as we tilted the head to open the airway. The compression to breath ratio was 5:2. Then a couple years later, they changed it to 15:2. Now it's 30:2, and there's talk of the AHA changing it again to 'compression only'. Yeah, it has nothing to do with competence and knowledge.....

These courses are mandated for this very reason. To keep abreast of changes in policy, and to implement new practices based on studies of 'the old way of doing things'.

These courses aren't mandated because the state/province thinks we have nothing better to do with our time, or to make things complicated for us. They're mandated because they're a necessary tool to keep us up on our knowledge and competency of our role in emergency medical intervention.

The fact that MA has suspended her for 9 months for knowingly breaking the rules is far better than the alternative (which should be the 'norm') and revoking her license and certifications PERMANENTLY.

As far as what she's going to do.....the only advice I can offer is: "Suck it up, cupcake! Take your lumps, you've earned them.".

[croaker260]

http://www.emsresponder.com/article/article.jsp?id=13846&siteSection=1

A quote from the article:

"She said the harsh punishment of EMTs is unfair, especially because she believes the refresher courses they're required to take have no bearing on competence and knowledge."

Hmmm, How would she know if they had no bearing or not on her competence, as she DIDNT TAKE THE COURSE!

Seriously, the first EMT refresher course I took took the by the book refresher aproach. No , absolutely no, new information,

I promised myself that when I got into education I would never inflict that on anyone.

Ive been in education now for about 8 years or more. I have coordinated refresher courses for about 6 years. We have MDS, PA,s specialist, LEO's, and all sorts of specialist help teahc topic matter. We cover the objectives, and stil provide new information in a fun way.

if you are going to a canned sleep inducing refresher course, come up my way. I'll change your mind. BTW, our material isapproved by the state and NREMT.

[Richard B the EMT]

She says if she broke the law, she should be punished.

Guess what? She broke the law, and is being punished.

"The refresher course just repeats everything. We didn't put you at harm," Kim said.

I don't know about that. Lone Star had it correct...

As far as the refresher courses having 'no bearing on competence and knowledge', just what does she think these refresher courses are for?

How many times have we taken a CPR refresher course, only to find that the AHA (or similar agency) has changed the guidelines? Look at how many times the compression to breath ratio alone has been changed!

Don't even get me started on the CPR protocol of the Pre-Cardial Thump. That has changed so many times on my 37 years as an EMT. I don't even know if it is still used in any manner, shape or form, by either American Heart Association or American Red Cross standards anymore.

Terry Urekew ... believes the state has done an injustice to her colleagues.

"So if it's fraud, slap them. Give everyone a $100 fine and community service" said Urekew. "Don't take someone's livelihood away from something that has no impact on whether or not we are better EMTs,"

If you're working as an EMT or Paramedic, when you knowingly don't have the license or certification, you're taking work away from persons who earned the titles. You don't qualify for the job, hence, it can NOT be your livelihood. It could be considered Felony/criminal impersonation. No fines for the miscreants, here, or simply banning them from becoming EMTs or Paramedics at some later time. They might go to a different state or provence, and there apply again for the job.

No! Give them new jobs. Have them make small rocks out of large rocks at the local Bureau of Prisons for a year and a day!

While there are some who accuse me of being a lackadaisical EMT, those accusers at least know I passed the classes for my level of training, same as them.

[JPINFV]

Seriously, the first EMT refresher course I took took the by the book refresher aproach. No , absolutely no, new information,

100 times this. A lot of refreshers are nothing more than 24 hours of time that active providers will never get back. After my first refresher, I promised myself that I'd avoid them as much as possible (last NREMT recert was done by exam). However, just because I question the actual value of many of the refresher courses, I don't gain the right to just ignore the requirement.

[BAYAMedic]

I say make the punishment truly fit the crime. Suspend them all until they have compleated a full initial certification class. If they are a Paramedic they get to do the full 1000 hours and the basics get the 110 hours. Then make them go back to probationary status regardless of years of experiance. Put them for a specified amout of time doing cabulance/ IFT work where they can't hurt anyone and focus on LEGAL documentation. I had my EMT-Basic and didn't do the required OTEP as I had taken a vacation from EMS and fire work (I am still out of the fire side of things but I have had the nickname since I was 16). Guess what I had to retake the initial class. At first I was LIVID about having to do it to get my license back. BUT the last day of class I thanked the professor at the college where I took it. I didn't realize how much I had forgotten and how much there was to the class if you want to get the most out of it. Now here I am, in a better position due to my full initial class to start Paramedic school this fall. Just my .02

Fireman1037

[Lone Star]

I say make the punishment truly fit the crime. Suspend them all until they have compleated a full initial certification class. If they are a Paramedic they get to do the full 1000 hours and the basics get the 110 hours. Then make them go back to probationary status regardless of years of experiance. Put them for a specified amout of time doing cabulance/ IFT work where they can't hurt anyone and focus on LEGAL documentation. I had my EMT-Basic and didn't do the required OTEP as I had taken a vacation from EMS and fire work (I am still out of the fire side of things but I have had the nickname since I was 16). Guess what I had to retake the initial class. At first I was LIVID about having to do it to get my license back. BUT the last day of class I thanked the professor at the college where I took it. I didn't realize how much I had forgotten and how much there was to the class if you want to get the most out of it. Now here I am, in a better position due to my full initial class to start Paramedic school this fall. Just my .02

Fireman1037

When my license for the State of Michgan expired, I was stuck in the State of Ga. I'm sure I could have fudged the necessary paperwork to renew my license without sitting my butt in the classes.

Instead, I did the only honorable thing I could do...I started over (much to the chagin of my EMT-B instructor). Since I did the 'right thing', I've moved up one license level and am waiting for the next medic class to begin so I can go back to it.

Had I been able to renew my license on time, I would probably still be an EMT-B. There definately was a 'reward' in doing things properly!

*edited to correct grammatical error.

Edited July 2, 2010 by Lone Star

[Chief1C]

Where do I get my fake medical degree?

[Lone Star]

I say make the punishment truly fit the crime. Suspend them all until they have compleated a full initial certification class. If they are a Paramedic they get to do the full 1000 hours and the basics get the 110 hours. Then make them go back to probationary status regardless of years of experiance. Put them for a specified amout of time doing cabulance/ IFT work where they can't hurt anyone and focus on LEGAL documentation.

That's like letting an embezzler keep their job until they pay off however much they embezzled before they got caught.

They've already proven that they don't want to do what it takes to keep their license/certification current, so why let them have a 'second chance' at doing it again?

With the multitude of EMT's and Medics waiting in the wings to get those slots, let those that are willing to do what's necessary work the field. At least it will prove beneficial to the patient, which is what it’s all about in the first place!

We're not talking about an offense as trivial as slipping an extra donut or two into the bag for the customer, we're talking about putting people's lives at risk. 211 EMT's/medics have proven that keeping their education and skills current isn't worth the 'hassle'.

If the punishment were to truly fit the crime, then they should have their licenses/certifications/privileges permanently revoked. End of story!

[cosgrojo]

Clearly this Kate woman is not someone I want caring for anyone that I know or care for. She does not seem to understand the basic tenets of responsibility. It is clear that she wants no part in taking any responsibility for her transgressions.

But let's not fool ourselves about refreshers here people. I know we are all pro education, and anyone that isn't shall be fed to the angry Gods of the City, but refreshers are mostly handled poorly, taught inadequately, and not to mention, being phased out by the Registry. If Refreshers are so important and vitals to becoming a better EMT, why is the Registry trying to streamline the process? NR now offers a Test-out option in-lieu of traditional class and practical time. I for one am glad for it. Being a full time EMT, and occasionally involved the the education of new EMT's I am constantly staying abreast of the "new stuff." For me, refreshers seem superfluous. I would rather just prove my knowledge through a quick and easy test, and not be bothered with sitting in a class room for 24 hours getting bored to death.

This is not an anti-education spiel, but I am anti-refresher... for me. That's why I like the refresher opt-out clause that the registry has come up with. If you know your s%#t, prove it... and we won't make you sit through it again... if you fail... take a seat and try and remember it this time.

My problem with these people is that they are not taking their responsibilities seriously. Whether you agree with the way the system works or not, you have to abide by the rules, or get out. If you don't like it, get involved to try and change it, but don't try and cheat your way through, and then say you cheated because the requirement is stupid. In my opinion these people deserved their punishment, and they only have themselves to blame by accepting a program and a recertification that they knew was against the rules. Not wanting to go to a refresher is normal, actually skipping out of it and falsely claiming you went may not mean you are a poor EMT, but it does make you a cheat, and a liar. And if you compound that by then trying to say you didn't really do anything wrong, then you are just stupid and a bad person.