Interesting youtube find.

[basejump]

So i'm on youtube searching ambulance calls when this video comes up so I clicked it because it looked interesting. We all know a good portion of drivers do not pay attention half of the time due to cell phones,texting,and the fact most people are oblivious to sirens and lights when they hear or see them. I'm not sure who the blame fell on for this incident. But if it was me, I probably would have approached a bit slower. But who am I to judge, I wasn't in their situation at that specific time. Here is the video. Thought's?

Toronto EMS

Edited September 13, 2010 by basejump

[HERBIE1]

Unlcear who is at fault. Did the ambo have the green light? Either way, that crew did not even slow down- I would fault them, regardless of whether they had the light or not. Even with a green light, you need to slow or even come to a complete stop if necessary. An intersection with multiple lanes, stopped cars and turning lanes- major danger. All it takes is one driver to ignore his surroundings- ie the fact that every other car is stopped for some reason, not paying attention, on the phone, listening to the radio, closed windows.

Intersections are the number one location for crashes- that crew pulled a major fail. Luckily, the crash did not look too bad and hopefully no one was hurt.

[FireMedic65]

From what it looked like to me... it was, of course, a 4 way intersection. Most likely everyone had the red light, and maybe there were turn only lights on.. or just that moment where the timers turned everyone to red.

Now, for who was at fault... I would say, the ambulance. They were in emergent mode lights on. They did not appear to slow down at the intersection. Regardless of the incident, ambulances still have to obey ALL TRAFFIC LAWS even if they are driving around or responding/transporting. It also also unclear that if there siren was active, which is MUST be (at least here in PA). When the lights are on, the siren must be active as well.

[JPINFV]

Regardless of the incident, ambulances still have to obey ALL TRAFFIC LAWS even if they are driving around or responding/transporting.

Sigh.

No, they don't. In general lights and sirens provides exemptions to most, if not all traffic laws while essentially placing blame for any accidents on the emergency vehicle operator under the concept of due regard. If ambulances had to obey all traffic laws, then there is no reason to even have more than amber lights to mark when an ambulance is parked on a roadway.

Also, how many people here slow down and stop at green lights in their POV?

[FireMedic65]

Sigh.

No, they don't. In general lights and sirens provides exemptions to most, if not all traffic laws while essentially placing blame for any accidents on the emergency vehicle operator under the concept of due regard. If ambulances had to obey all traffic laws, then there is no reason to even have more than amber lights to mark when an ambulance is parked on a roadway.

Also, how many people here slow down and stop at green lights in their POV?

Yes, they must obey the same laws you and I do when driving to get groceries. Having a siren and lights do not make you exempt from speeding, running red lights/stop signs. They do, however, when in emergent mode.. give you the right of away to STOP at those lights and signs... and if no one else is passing through, you may cautiously proceed. But if there is moving traffic.. you can't bully your way through legally.

[JPINFV]

Yes, they must obey the same laws you and I do when driving to get groceries. Having a siren and lights do not make you exempt from speeding, running red lights/stop signs. They do, however, when in emergent mode.. give you the right of away to STOP at those lights and signs... and if no one else is passing through, you may cautiously proceed. But if there is moving traffic.. you can't bully your way through legally.

So... what state are you in again?

[FireMedic65]

So... what state are you in again?

Pennsylvania

[JPINFV]

§ 3105. Drivers of emergency vehicles.

(a) General rule.--The driver of an emergency vehicle, when responding to an emergency call or when in the pursuit of an actual or suspected violator of the law or when responding to but not upon returning from a fire alarm or other emergency call, may exercise the privileges set forth in this section, but subject to the conditions stated in this section.

( Exercise of special privileges.--The driver of an emergency vehicle may:

(1) Park or stand, irrespective of the provisions of this part.

(2) Proceed past a red signal indication or stop sign, but only after slowing down as may be necessary for safe operation, except as provided in subsection (d).

(3) Exceed the maximum speed limits so long as the driver does not endanger life or property, except as provided in subsection (d).

(4) Disregard regulations governing direction of movement, overtaking vehicles or turning in specified directions.

...

(d) Ambulances, blood delivery vehicles and human organ delivery vehicles.--The driver of an ambulance, blood delivery vehicle or human organ delivery vehicle shall comply with maximum speed limits, red signal indications and stop signs. After ascertaining that the ambulance, blood delivery vehicle or human organ delivery vehicle will be given the right-of-way, the driver may proceed through a red signal indication or stop sign.

http://www.dmv.state.pa.us/pdotforms/vehicle_code/chapter31.pdf

Emphasis added. In other words, an ambulance in PA can, when responding to an emergency, proceed against a red light, park or stand where ever it needs, and disregard rules governing turns and direction of traffic. When transporting, they can proceed against red lights, and I imagine that the rules governing direction of traffic isn't enforced. All of these are against the law for vehicles not engaged in an emergency response or transport. Otherwise, at 2 am I wouldn't have to wait for a green light if no on coming traffic was coming.

Edit:

I should also state that, at least in California, there is no specific regulation of ambulances separate from other emergency vehicles, and those regulations is merely a list of the traffic code that emergency vehicles are exempt from provided they display a forward facing burning red lamp while sounding a siren as needed.

Edited September 14, 2010 by JPINFV

[Richard B the EMT]

Per all my Emergency Vehicle Operating Courses, emergency vehicles are at higher risk of being in an accident whenever they have the L&S on. Here in New York State, we have Vehicle and Traffic Law 1104, which states all vehicles will be operated with due regard to other vehicles, even when, per other VTL sections, allowing emergency vehicles to disregard traffic signals, traffic control devices, speed limits, etc.

Also, the FDNY only allows our vehicles (including engines and truck companies) to travel no faster than 10 MPH above posted speeds, and never go faster than 50 MPH, which is also the fastest posted roadway speed in NYC.

[a_shane2_go]

It was the crew at fault. Although they slowed down a bit for the intersection they did not stop, or slow down enough to see the on coming traffic.

They had cars on their passenger side, and so did the car that hit them. THE worst situation at a 4 way you can ask for. Whenever I’m in the city responding lights and I’m in this situation I slow down to near stop to avoid this.

Here in Alberta we as drivers are held accountable. And in our traffic laws it states ambulance operators may violate traffic laws only "When it is safe to do so." Get hit, it wasn't safe.

So here we CYA with driving. We're held accountable.