unions?

[HERBIE1]

Ok all; let's go to the bathroom and compare penis sizes. Does it matter who makes more? No matter how much you make; there's always someone who makes more. I think we're venturing well off the topic. All the best...

Agreed.

Money is a bad tangent. Someone working in a rural area- with a low cost of living- can do quite well on their salary there, but if they moved to NYC, making the same pay, would probably end up on food stamps. Nevermind comparing salaries and benefits here in the US vs Canada- it's comparing apples to Buicks.

[Happiness]

So first of all I will say I am not a union person (my grandfather will be rolling in his grave) Yes I am a part of a union because I have to be, it is what it is and if I want to continue this job i am.

So in my experiense with I.W.A.(not my union I also am a bean counter) we had two employee's verbally and phyically assualt a manager of a forestry company that was getting our organization to complete a survey. This mananger sent in a written report, it was investigated, they both admitted to their actions and they were fired. The union became involved and after a 2 year fight we had to not only hire them back we had to pay them compensation. This was wrong at every level. After this these two thought they could do whatever, when ever they wanted. They are both gone now thank god.

Now when we (BCAS) were on strike about 10 years ago, one of the action items was to not write in the billing information on our forms. I continued doing this only because I was use to doing so, not because I was against the action. Then one day our union called me and told me if I kept on doing this they were going to take away my "Good Standing" and I wouldn't be able to work again. This was not said to me nicely this was a threat to me, even after I explained what was what. I told the guy to go *&^%&*& himself and hung up on him. I am still in Good Standing and I found away around his crap.

In my opinion Unions do back up the bad employee's and very rarely help the ones that are compliant.

I truely believe that Unions back in the day did have a purpose and they did some great things for employee's but there are better labour laws these days and most things can worked out with communication.

If you want to get your organization unionized please make sure that you weigh the pro's and con's because in most cases you only need certain % to get in one, but if you want out it is 100%.

As for the Smoking in an Ambulance I truely think that if you have employee's doing this they should be fired it is such a saftey issue and just stupid who wants to placed in vehical that smells like tobacco. And so you know I am a smoker.

Good luck in your research on this topic

happy

[JPINFV]

Not following sorry ?

You wanted to compare paychecks with the anti-union people. I agreed that we should compare your paycheck to the average wage for my non-union field. You agreed and tried to claim that paramedics make more than physicians. You never limited the comparison of paychecks simply to non-union paramedics.

Oh I will bite, even though its way off topic .. your making reference to soft wood lumber dispute ? I have a little surprise for you the NFTA (agreement) is a joke and there is no FREE in it ! Its a one way love affair and highly likely to be re-evaluated soon.

One who has the most dirty oil natural resources will always win its the rule sorry about. I just made phone call, your cost of gas and oil will be going up now HUGE.

cheers

I'm actually comparing to just tariffs in general. Countries don't like to have their goods taxed more just because the other country makes it too and will generally respond by placing tariffs of their own.

[tniuqs]

Ok anecdotal stories: Can I share too?

I was accused of something (doest matter what it was government employee at the time) I was wrongly accused, was put off work, complied with employers every wish, finally "allowed" to return to work, after jumping through the many hoops.

I filed a grievance because the accusation was bull shit and detrimental to my life and career, huge stress. The facts in the case were crystal clear that the employer did not investigate the initial complaint (an unidentified complaint most curiously) or have enough facts to even start "putting me off duty" !

Without a Union and their Lawyer I would have been screwed, blued and tattooed standing in a empty field digging ditches broke, trying to fight for my rights ... don't tell me for one milisecond that an private EMS employer will back a "worker" unless it is in the interest of the employer.

So Happy I must fall into your BAD employee categorised list.

In another situation I actually quit my position when a 95% union members took strike vote (I did not support I left (very simple) these in the early days of EMS in AB when EDM city took over EMS from a private operator that was under investigation for embezzlement of funds and double billing, interesting.

We were working for 14 hours and were paid for 10, as the Alberta Labour Law stated at that time (its changed now oddly enough)

I took a huge cut in pay left and went somewhere else as at the time I did not feel I could strike myself, sure as hell I can now but now. Then essential services clause and direct to binding arbitration so what choice does one have .. really?

I went to work for a friend (who also had worked prior place) BUT he was a Private EMS Operator and during the strike HE stabbed all his friends in the back and ran one of his trucks to "make a quick buck" ... by the way he went out of business .. no union destroyed his operation his greed did.

PERIOD.

[JPINFV]

I've never held a union job and never felt mistreated by my employers. If I ever did, however, I always maintain the choice to simply not work there. No one has the right to have employment, but thankfully some states do recognize that workers have a right not to finance the goon squad.

[Happiness]

OK JP I'm not sure if your refering to me and the IWA as the soft wood lumber,if so, you really read that wrong. It had nothing to do with that period.

As for you Squint Yes you are BAD. But the point is that most unions do not support the good employees and most of the time it isnt the good ones that are running to the union, it is the ones that need to go.

I did notice no one commented on the fact that I did say there was a time that Unions were a great resource for the employment arena.

[HERBIE1]

I've never held a union job and never felt mistreated by my employers. If I ever did, however, I always maintain the choice to simply not work there. No one has the right to have employment, but thankfully some states do recognize that workers have a right not to finance the goon squad.

I think most folks have good and bad union stories. Years ago my dad was the manager of a building supply warehouse. All Teamsters Union drivers. He received a tip a guy was stealing supplies and delivering them on the side. Knowing that in order to fire a union worker you essentially needed video taped evidence, sworn affidavits from everyone including the pope and endorsed by God, he tried to obtain solid proof on his own before coming forward with the allegations. To make a long story short, the company did a routine audit, and because of the discrepancy in the inventory, he was fired. Another driver stepped up, vouched for my dad, and corroborated that this other employee was in fact stealing. No proof , and the thief had since left the company. No case. Didn't matter- dad was gone. Years later, when I was organizing a union in my company, dad was NOT happy with me- even though he understood my reasons.

Point is, whether or not the union is a positive depends on your point of view, the particular company, the union, and the type of business. In other words, blanket, broad brush statements can be wrong, but yes, there are certain commonalities to all of these situations.

[NYCEMS9115]

This is a topic which will have all sides in the discussion. If someone(s) want a Union, that's great. If someone works where it has a Union, that'sgreat. If you don't like your Union, that's great. If you want your Union out, that's great. I've been on both sides; with a Union and w/o a Union. Never needed my Union and never had issues at my non Union job. I always gave 100%. Even on my worst day; I was better than most. I never preached CYA (Cover Your Ass); I don't need it. I have good work ethics. My files, at all my jobs, never had a negative report. Its not about being a kiss ass or a show-off; its about doing what you're suppose to do. Not all Employers are out to get the Employees. Despite what many say; sometimes its them and they don't see it. Sometimes the Union just masked the problem(s).

Ex. I have an Employee; habitually late; he's been late more times than one has digits (a 15 min window is given before a write is issue) in a year. He was fired for his chronic lateness (mind you, they do 3: 13hr 20min tours a week) and the Union fought for his job back. He got it back. You figure he'll be punctual but he's not. He's always fashionably late and write up late. Plus he's a slacker; holds signals and goes off post. His file is so thick (There can only be so many final warnings and suspension one can get). Once we have enough new hires; he'll be fired for his attendance. Unfortunately, NYS will still allow someone like that to collect unemployment & my company will have to pay for it. That's what's wrong; when you have the Unions and Govt against the Employers. Its 2 vs 1; what kind of odds are those?

That being said, the Union can be a intergral part of the Employee and Employer alliance; it can show workforce deficiencies and management errors but they too are a business who really look out for its own entity. Members are not part of this. Ex. Look at 1199SEIU; the largest Union for Healthcare Workers on the East Coast. It did nothing when all the Union Hospitals were closing or are slated to close due to the Berger Commission Report. Many were and are still laid off from a NYC Hospital who closed in 2007. The employees there could have save the Union dues and in one year the avg person could have save $2900+ a year. Just something to think about.

[tniuqs]

You wanted to compare paychecks with the anti-union people. I agreed that we should compare your paycheck to the average wage for my non-union field. You agreed and tried to claim that paramedics make more than physicians. You never limited the comparison of paychecks simply to non-union paramedics.

I'm actually comparing to just tariffs in general. Countries don't like to have their goods taxed more just because the other country makes it too and will generally respond by placing tariffs of their own.

Happiness

Posted Today, 12:21 PM

OK JP I'm not sure if your refering to me and the IWA as the soft wood lumber,if so, you really read that wrong. It had nothing to do with that period.

As for you Squint Yes you are BAD. But the point is that most unions do not support the good employees and most of the time it isnt the good ones that are running to the union, it is the ones that need to go.

I did notice no one commented on the fact that I did say there was a time that Unions were a great resource for the employment arena.

cheers

reason for edit 2 fold, fear of Dwayne and damn quote things

Edited January 25, 2011 by tniuqs

[Happiness]

Dear Happiness:

So you where a member of a BCAS when they took job action, but didn't support the action well isn't that kind of hypocritical when you get your pay check ... do you return the negotiated wage increases, like really, you didn't support but you reap the benefit

Is it any wonder why CUPE failed last round trying to get equal pay for equal work during the "non strike" remember ? Pay equal to other Emergency Workers like FF or Police (I think they called it Same Scene Same Pay ... it just doesn't boil down to one poor Union Leader.

Awe here we go to the battle of the twits

#1 Yes I am a member of BCAS. I dont recall saying in my post that I didnt support the strike as I am a pretty conciderate person for other beliefs, and please remember this is not my primary career, I do this job for my community. What I said is that, some jerk from the union threatened to get me fired because I was not being compliant in the job action, and I was not being compliant because I kept completing the Billing information and this was done because I always completed the information blocks on my forms as I do today. Make sense ? After that call I did become compliant, and hence here I am.

#2 Now shall we get onto the last strike. That strike was more between the Government and the Union and didn't have alot of input from the paramedics themselves unless it involved bad behaviour. The Union tried to make BCAS not show up for the Olympic's and to not have the employee's do any overtime. First the Olympic's did the union really think that the Olympic's were going to not happen if the paramedics didn't show up. That was their idea and many others from other provinces supported that action, but in reality there were many paramedics from BC that joined up and I know a few of them. This was a once in a lifetime opportunity for our paramedics to be part of Olymic's and there were some fringe benifits that went with going. If you remember correctly there was an actual black list of those paramedics and they were threatened, some of their homes were damaged with their families terrified inside and alot of them had their tires slashed ect. Have you Squint heard about any of those rouge paramedics being charge for anything....nope because it has been pushed under the rug by the union,and is now concidered "One of those things we dont talk about".

Now to the stopping of overtime, I do get this and I think that the Government was a bully to go to court and get the injunction that stated "If you were able to pull extra time before the strike you are required to do it now" but on the other side of that coin, who is going to suffer the most if the paramedics didn't do the OT. Have pts be taken care of by Managers that have been out of the field for years, that dosn't sound right to me. In this strike I did do what I was told out of respect of my fellow paramedics. I didn't really want to after all of the bad behaviour but I did. And FYI Squint please keep in mind with these strike's it isn't the part timers that benifit, it is the full time employee's yet I pay the same union dues and only get half the benifits.

I personally feel that I am very well paid for my job. If you think about it through labour laws, if I am called out I get paid for 4 hrs. Most of the time my call lasts for 1.5 hrs and many times less. I even get paid for the calls that get cancelled and I do nothing. My wage on an hourly rate goes from 26 to 104 per hour. Like I said before I do this for my community but I do understand that a full timers postition is harder as they have higher living costs and I do, do my part in supporting them.

Well there you go from one twit to another and so you know I am not a hypocrite in this matter what so ever but if you keep looking my way you will discover things I can be called a hyporite for. Again why cant someone call me on the good part of my post

Happy