12 week accelerated program Versus 2 yr Paramedic course.

[paramedicmike]

11outof10,

First of all, paragraphs are your friend. Use them. Use them liberally. Use them well. I think you'll find that people will understand what you're trying to say much better. At the very least, I think you'll find that people actually read diatribes like what you just posted.

You're a student. You have no idea what you don't know. Yet you presume to know more than senior members here. You presume to think that what you're doing is smarter than people who have not only gone through the process but are now involved in trying to improve the process. If you wish to continue to dig your hole in ignorance mountain please continue. But if you're truly dedicated to learning then I suggest you stop digging.

There hasn't been a single "back in my day" comment in this thread. What there has been, however, are people who have been through the process and are now educators themselves telling you that you have no idea what you're talking about. We may disagree on some points. Pointing out people who don't know what they're talking about is one of those things on which we seldom disagree.

I suggest when you know what you're talking about on this particular subject you come back and try again. Until then you have clearly demonstrated yourself, despite professing to want to succeed, to be a part of the problem that EMS faces every day. And that's not what we need.

[mobey]

......But we are still necessary. Without Basics and Medics doing what we do, most of these people would never make it to the ER in the first place. If we all want change so bad then lets do it. Lets demand associate degree programs. I'm all for it.

That's the spirit!

Just an FYI: It takes a little under 4 yrs to become a Paramedic in Canada. About the same, or even more in Australia.

Sorry, gotta pick on you here;

I stop bleeding and hold peoples hand when their grandma dies.

Please check out the last scenario I posted and rethink the above statement.

EMS is still a very young system compared to health care in general

I fully realize that you are just parroting this from other providers out there so don't take this personal. This "EMS is young" mantra is absolute rubbish. EMS WAS young in the 80's! Now EMS is a full grown adult that must be accountable for itself just like any other profession. Blaming corruption, ignorance, greed, and misdirection on the fact that the profession is "Only" 30yrs+ old is a crutch used by providers and management to continue a cycle of unaccountability and lazyness.

[paramedicmike]

I do agree with you, we should know more about patients conditions. We only have certain types of protocols that we can perform, and a limited number of medications (Which probably don't cover those things) that we can administer. Having knowledge of a large number of conditions can be useful in forming an accurate field impression but doesn't necessarily change how we would treat those patients. I'm not disagreeing with you by any means. Knowledge is power.

Do you honestly believe this? This simply confirms the point I was trying to make.

Try again, Grasshopper.

Medicine is not about skills or protocols. The sooner you learn this the better off you, and more importantly your patients, will be.

[chbare]

Hmmm, just to let you know; these "paramedic practitioner" like providers you speak of are not graduates if any three month programme that I am aware of. The Austrailian ICP (Intensive Care Paramedic) is the equivalent of a four year degree prepared provider in the United States. The South African B-Tech paramedic also has a four year degree. In fact, a comprehensive research project is mandatory for B-Tech graduates. A guy I worked with in Afghanistan did his own prospective project comparing physician and paramedic endo-tracheal tube cuff pressure management techniques along with the presence of potential mucosal ischaemia.

Take care,

chbare.

All apologies for formatting errors, my iPhone is being a real POS tonight. No excuses, but I want to explain the rather interesting post above.

Take care,

chbare.

Edited March 12, 2011 by chbare

[11outof10]

OK, honestly i Don't know how it got to this point. I have not tried to be negative about anyone. I have simply pointed out that I am attempting to apply myself the best i can. I don't really understand why everyone is jumping my case about it. Dwayne says i ride around in ambulances and giggle while the lights are on. Mike, is that the wealth of information that you are talking about? I really don't understand the hostility

I admit i don't know everything and have much learning to do. What points are we still arguing about?

[paramedicmike]

I have simply pointed out that I am attempting to apply myself the best i can. I don't really understand why everyone is jumping my case about it.

Because you intimated that taking shortcuts was acceptable not only for paramedicine but also for nursing. That is hardly applying yourself the best that you can.

I admit i don't know everything and have much learning to do. What points are we still arguing about?

How new to discussion forums like this one are you?

Any given thread can cover a variety of topics. Threads can be easily derailed from comments like yours suggesting shortcuts are ok. They can also evolve over the course of discussion as points are raised or contested.

[11outof10]

Ok, i get it mike, i suck at EMS and at forums. jesus christ, is that the last nail yet?

[Kiwiology]

If you want to be seen as a looser homeostatic imbalance with poor cognitive function who follows a cookbook written for retards then go take the 12 week course.

Or you could come here where it takes FOUR YEARS to become a Paramedic (ILS) and SIX YEARS to become an Intensive Care Paramedic (ALS)

[paramedicmike]

Ok, i get it mike, i suck at EMS and at forums. jesus christ, is that the last nail yet?

Who said you suck at anything?

Relax, Grasshopper. I don't know you. You don't know me. Comments here are strictly business and shouldn't be taken personally. That's a lesson some of the more serious contenders for longevity here in these forums learn early on. Seeing as you're still pretty new here, this might be a good time to learn this one.

[DwayneEMTP]

I know that for myself that I am hoping that you're going to open your eyes and begin to see that no one is jumping your case at all. People are trying to tell you that some folks have fed you a line of shit, and you've fallen for it. That doesn't mean that your program is bad, nor that you will be a bad provider someday, but only that there are a ton of smart folks her trying to guide you but you keep responding with 'Why does everyone keep picking on me?"

You have explained what it means to be a good medic to me, a half assed medic that has had the privilege to work with some really good medics, when you are not yet a medic. You explained to me the value of a college education when, I have one, you don't. I have done medicine on the streets, in Afghanistan, in the hospital, and now remote medicine on the oil spill in the gulf. And yet you want to tell me that my logic and attitude are substandard. Good on you, but be ready to back it up.

The 'old guy' mentality I bring? I've been a medic for...say...5-6 years...I don't remember. No old guy shit here brother. Just guy shit.

You explain your superior program and yet your skin is so thin that you can't see that you're not being attacked, but given advice, and you need it. There is no one in this thread that hasn't stood me on my head intellectually, and some have knocked my dick so far down into the dirt that I had to scrub for weeks to get the mud off, before I 'got it.' Mike, in just the last several days has called me out twice...once I agreed with him, once I didn't...but I promise you that nowhere in my response to the posts that I didn't agree with will you find the sentiment, "Mike, why are you so mean?" And you know why? Not because I don't care what he thinks..I very much care what he thinks of me and my opinions. But because it would never occur to me that he was calling me out simply to be an asshole. In fact everyone in this thread, including you, have have made me better with their arguments, not by whining. And it will be my privileged to lose arguments to you too if you stay long enough.

And lastly, as I need to quit screwing around so that I can go to bed and get back up in a couple of hours..I thought that it was obvious that my comments were directed at your supporting another posters possible path of going to a nooner patch factory instead of a two year college. That was then, if I remember right, followed by you explaining that you intended to take the shortest, least educational route to being an RN. I didn't insult your school, as we hadn't even spoken of your school yet. But the attitude you have brought, up until your last two or three posts had wannabe whacker written all over it. I hope that I am completely off in the ditch as nothing would make me happier than to see you become a rockstar medic and make me eat shit every single day.

Also, your last few posts showed some fire! And some actual debate! (Until you puked on your last one...but still, it's movement in the right direction!) You think that I think I'm Mr. Supersmart Medic? Go to my profile, jump back to my first posts and see what a complete whacker moron I was before these fine folks did for me what they're trying to do for you. I like to think that I'm no longer a whacker...

But...you need to toughen up princess!! (See, a lesson disguised as an insult?) No one here is attacking you. They are teaching...you just seem to want to be coddled. You've been a basic plenty long enough to know that mentally, emotionally, and sometimes physically, EMS is a contact sport. So don't hold your breath waiting for the velvet gloves to come out, as no one here with any significant value is going to baby you. But if you trip and fall? Every single one of them, yeah, me too, will do everything in their power to make sure that you never hit the ground. It's what I love about EMTCity, and what I love, when it's there, about EMS.

Have a good day brother. I'm truly grateful that you've decide to stay and have your say instead of running away like so many do after their first skinned knee. I have a feeling that you will be really good at this, and that you will have a lot to offer, and I look forward to learning from you.

Dwayne

Note. My apologies for errors. It's late, and I'm really really tired, but am afraid that this thread will be locked and wanted this to go out into the ozone so I didn't proof read.

Edited March 12, 2011 by DwayneEMTP