uniform

[Ridryder 911]

Never.. I will not tolerate bad behvior, but yet again I don't off duty as well, but to really use authority ?.. I think we are getting way too much of ourselves..

Like Admin described this has been discussed several times...

R/r 911

[ncmedic309]

Never.. I will not tolerate bad behvior, but yet again I don't off duty as well, but to really use authority ?.. I think we are getting way too much of ourselves..

Like Admin described this has been discussed several times...

R/r 911

It might have been discussed several times, but I didn't get to put my 2 cents in on it. It's not about "getting way too much of ourselves", it's about doing what it takes to get the job done. Quite simply put, you have the authority to restrain a patient vs. letting them kick your ass in the back of the truck, you have the authority to force a patient that is mentally unfit to make their own decisions seek further medical care. Believe it or not, even us EMS folks have some degree of authority.

[Dustdevil]

NC, you're really reaching now. Everybody in America has that very same "authority." Therefore, it's not authority at all. It is simply the same right of every person. Not to mention the absurdity of believing the badge is what gives you that "authority" or the belief that mental incompetents care about your badge. Funny, I've never seen anybody in the psych wards wearing a badge. In fact, I have never seen ANY other healthcare professional wearing a badge, yet they seem to have functioned just fine for hundreds of years longer than we have. I suppose it is only medics that feel impotent to practise their craft without a penis extension. We're the ones who are going to show all the other medical professionals how things should be done, right? :roll:

If you, like our new friend here, had read the link that Admin provided, you would know that you are not saying anything new. And what you are saying has been thoroughly thrashed into embarrassing defeat in at least two other threads. Stick with that theory if you wish. But the bottom line is that anybody with that point of view simply has no better justification than a self-serving desire to look "cool."

[ncmedic309]

Where did I mention anything about a badge giving me or anyone else authority? Try reading my post again...

Authority - "the power to influence or persuade resulting from knowledge or experience"

Take that definition and apply it to the job that we do...You can be hard-headed and only see it from one view or you can look at it for what it is, and attempt to understand the point I'm trying to make. It really makes no difference to me, I know how to do my job, and I know all about the authority I have and where it reaches. I don't use it to make myself feel better about anything, I use it to make the best decisions possible when caring for my patients. Not "everyone in america" has that authority, nor the knowldege or experience to use it properly.

[1aCe3]

I'm going to respond to you in a different way... the way in which I wished some others had done when I had first posted one of the original badge posts with pure innocence. Although I believe I later made somewhat of a point, it seemingly didnt cross the path due to the utter thrashing :roll: the original topic had. Just for the sake of concluding it, and to tell some newer folks about it:

We as EMS providers have no authority in written law. Although we are at times labeled as public safety officers, this in fact does not mean anything but the fact that we are protected by laws that deter violence against a profession that is more susceptible to dangers compared to your average job. The same goes for your postal worker or meter maid.

As dust was pointing out, we have as much authority as any other citizen. "Authority - "the power to influence or persuade resulting from knowledge or experience" As surgeons have as much "authority" to tell another to step out of his/her OR, or a gas attendent has as much to tell a patron not to smoke their cigarette by the gas pumps. We may tell a bystander to remove himself from a scene, but that individual has all the power to decide for himself whether to leave or not. Thing is, you can't lawfully do squat if they decide not to obey your command. Same goes for the surgeon, or gas attendent. The POLICE is the only official that is able to determine whether it is lawful or not, and can forcibly remove the individual. Therefore, why would EMS individuals wear a shield then?

Perhaps to have the individual believe that EMS does indeed have the "authority" to tell them what to do. If the individual concedes, then very well, the badge has actually made your job easier. But this is as equal to the surgeon or gas attendent wearing a badge to create this false sense of authority. And when you look at some other points, the negatives far outway the positives. The shield attracts attention, dangerous bystanders and any other individual who deem authority figures as a threat will only put you in harms way. One day you find a uncooperative bystander looking at your shield and immediately listens to you by backing away from your patient, a few hours later, a drug dealer see's that shield and shoots you. I think it's safe to say that the EMT in question would rather have an annoying bystander looking over his/her shoulder then to be shot later on. A bystander may also be swayed by the uniform, or just the sheer fact that you are trying to do your job. To many factors, and the risk in regards to other negatives are just higher.

"Quite simply put, you have the authority to restrain a patient vs. letting them kick your ass in the back of the truck,"

Regarding the restraints,

You have absolutely no lawful authority to restrain a pt. These laws vary from state to state. Here in NY if the pt is in medical facility, 2 onscene MD's must cosign a restraining order. Outside of this environment, police MUST be present/and or will be the ones restraining the pt themselves. If EMS were to forcibly restrain a pt without either of these, then they would have lawsuits flying up so far their... well you get the point. Some may restrain them when it comes down to the EMT's own dire safety, some also wouldn't hesitate to knock the o2 tank in the combative pt's face when it comes to their life and it happens, but you don't have any lawful authority in doing so. So the conclusion is.. run.. run far away and get the police to avoid the lawsuits. But hey, if I thought restraining the pt would save a arm and leg, then I might think of breaking this protocol.

"you have the authority to force a patient that is mentally unfit to make their own decisions seek further medical care."

So does your average ER doc...

And finally of course there are those people that dust seems to like thrashing about EMT's that drive 100mph with sirens blazing for any type of call... those that have a authority complex that believe they can do whatever they want with that shiny piece of metal on their belt. Those that just fCk up the face of EMS.

Oh, by the way, I heard recently that a EMT upstate was arrested for impersonating a state official by have a NYS EMT shield while working for a private company. :shock:

[kristinaemtb]

we have registered badges with the choice to where them.they prefer we do....I prefer i dont.we have had shootings because they think we are cops.our unifirm consist of blue button up dress shirts and black bdu's with our black boots.very similar to our po;ice units.they wont open doors for us to come in.if they are high or drunk it gets bad because their train of thought is elsewhere.no to badges

[Ridryder 911]

Okay... kristinaemtb.. First Welcome to the site, we are glad you are here and thanks for posting. But, please do a little spell check (little button on the bottom) and some proof reading, with some proper grammar. Your posts are getting very hard to read....Again, welcome to the site!

R/r 911

[kristinaemtb]

I'm not in here to be perfect-sorry if you can not understand me.didn't know that mis-spelling was such a crime.I am in here for the first time.I didn't know YOUR rules JA

[Dustdevil]

I didn't know YOUR rules JA

So, you're saying you IGNORED the "Terms Of Service" that you agreed to when you signed up here? When you clicked the button that said you had read and agreed to the forum rules, you lied?

Please say it isn't so! :roll:

Now I more fully understand your post about not being much a book learner and preferring to learn things "hands on." You'd rather learn things -- like being a medic -- through trial and error rather than just reading the instructions first, eh? What the heck, it's only human lives, right? Not like there is a population shortage. Killing a few patients is no big deal.

So, when you screw up in the field, is this how you take constructive criticism?

[stream:0d92d34567]http://www.darryl.com/badges/bsbadges.wav[/stream:0d92d34567]

[Scaramedic]

Whoa down there Wilbur!

Kristinaemtb, I think the problem here might be that your typing like you are in a chat room. When you post please use the same rules you would use if you were writing a term paper. It makes it easier to understand and sounds much more professional.

As far as your response, it scares me that you get so angry over such a small thing as criticism of your spelling and grammar. How are you going to react when a patient insults you, are you going to tell them "F" off? And please have respect for those that paved the road you are walking down. I disagree with Rid about 75% of the time, but he deserves the respect of everyone here for his years of experience and helping EMS to grow into what we have today.

In short, grow up. You will not last here or in EMS with the attitude you are displaying.

Peace,

Marty

:thumbleft: