Clinicals and nurses

[chbare]

NREMT-Basic, I agree. Now, go get me some coffee.

Take care.

chbare.

[Just Plain Ruff]

NREMT-Basic I don't see anyone here blasting you.

You are not there to do excessive scut work but you are there to help out the nurses and do things for them that you might disagree with, like get coffee and deliver letters and what not. Excessive scut work is not something that should happen but I agree with the above poster.

A limited amount of scut work or "grunt work" is really expected. It was expected of me 16 years ago and it was expected of the students that i taught. It was probably more expected of the medic and emt students prior to my day.

If you do a limited amount of grunt work I can almost guarantee that you will be making the nurses job a little easier and more than likely you will get to do the more interesting things, like intubate and give lots of drugs, assist with Sutures, work a code. You'll get to do that anyway but it might come faster if you scratch their backs.

How can you say you are not there to make the nurses lives easier, starting an iv, giving a med, changing linens and cleaning vomit off a patient, how can you say that by doing those items you are not making the nurse life easier. She gets more paperwork done, takes care of more patients and in the end you get a happy nurse who is more likely to give you better assignments on subsequent shifts.

[JPINFV]

How can you say you are not there to make the nurses lives easier, starting an iv, giving a med, changing linens and cleaning vomit off a patient, how can you say that by doing those items you are not making the nurse life easier. She gets more paperwork done, takes care of more patients and in the end you get a happy nurse who is more likely to give you better assignments on subsequent shifts.

Simple. You are there to apply the skills and education you learned during your class. The fact that the nurses' job is easier is a side product. There is a difference between "being there to help" (goal=help nurse. The hospital should already have a bunch of these people employed. They're called ER techs, transport techs, and CNAs/PCAs) and "helping by being there" (You are there for a secondary reason then to help the nurse, but your actions assist the nurse with their patient care).

[txemt]

Part of the point I was making was in letting us practice our skills, the nurses' lives and jobs become easier. I had a nurse who asked me if I knew how to do something and when I answered yes, I was sent to do it, this freed up the nurse to go attend to the needs of the next patient , while I got to practice my skills. Simple as that, and the fact that the "problem" nurse didn't want a student doing anything, was the real problem. She had her own set of issues. I simply made myself scarce when she was around then she wasn't my problem. But I didn't only follow a nurse, I made myself accessable to the doctors, pa's and NP's. They where open to teaching new skills that aren't really designed for the medic but where pretty freakin cool :D/

[MrSpykes]

When I started my clinicals in the ER my first two 8hr shifts I probably got 15 glasses of ice chips, 100 glasses of water, 50 turkey sandwiches, fetched 30 wheelchairs, and cleaned more rooms than I can count. I did it all with a smile on my face. From there on out the nurses knew that i was willing to be a team player and help out. Then they started letting me start IV's, push meds give injections, start breathing treatments, and all out just perform my skills. I still clean rooms and do whatever is asked of me with out bitching and when ever a nurse has a good case or something neat is going to be done to a patient i am called in to watch or help. Moral of the story bust your ass and help out and prove to the nurses that you are willing to go the extra mile even if " its not your job" and you will do anything for them and they will throw you a bone and help you get experience.

[Ridryder 911]

Ever heard the old saying...."When in Rome"... Trust me, I have done more clinical time than some of you could imagine .. hmm 6 years and still counting.. Yes, there is a limit of gopher work, however not only are you there to learn clinical objectives, but as well to learn to work as a team member and fellow co-workers. I agree it may appear to be a waste of time, but yet again learning anything is never.

All students should remember that your main point is to learn, observe, and if possible perform skills and procedures you are allowed to improve upon. Performing clerical work is not doing this, or running errands, if there is activity going on in the ER, one needs to partipate on. Downtime, or performing tasks is another story....

Now, with that stated, a word of caution.... most ER's and its staff receive no compensation on allowing students in their facilities, in fact liability increases, work load increases as well. Facilities that allow or wants students need to be thanked for doing so. There are fewer and fewer that are allowing EMS students, (they are not required to) as well as many staff members prefer not to have a student following them around. So thank those that do participate and do a good job, they are getting less frequent...and is a very hot topic in the EMS education arena.

R/r 911

[cotjockey]

When I worked in the ER, I made a point of helping the students who helped us...if you were willing to clean a room or run to the lab, I was more likely to seek you out or make sure you got to be involved when there was an interesting (or even a boring) patient. The students who walked in with an attitude were left on their own a lot more...if they got in on a procedure they did, if they didn't oh well.

I fully believe that students are there to learn. I wouldn't dream of asking them to run to lab or clean a room if there was something else that they could be doing or learning. Students are not there to be staff's gophers...that is what techs or LPNs or CNAs are there for (at least in the ER I worked in). Techs, LPNs, and CNAs should not be standing there watching a procedure or helping out while an EMT or paramedic student misses out...there will be plenty more things for staff to do some other day...students have limited time. Running to lab and cleaning rooms is all part of the package, but not at the expense of missing out on something educational.

Ooops...didn't realize how old this post was...should be more careful!

[JakeEMTP]

It's not that old cotjockey, all is forgiven!

I just did another 24 hrs in the ED and never got coffee once! ( well once, but that is because we both wanted one ) My preceptor was extremely helpful. She asked what I wanted to do and when I said I required assessments for my clinical log, turned me over to triage. In my limited experience with ED staff, I have found them nothing but helpful with procedures or if I just had a question.

Oh well, I guess clinical time is what you make of it. It can be a excellent educational experience, or the longest 12 hrs of your life. The choice is yours alone.

[PrissyEMT]

It's not that old cotjockey, all is forgiven!

I just did another 24 hrs in the ED and never got coffee once! ( well once, but that is because we both wanted one ) My preceptor was extremely helpful. She asked what I wanted to do and when I said I required assessments for my clinical log, turned me over to triage. In my limited experience with ED staff, I have found them nothing but helpful with procedures or if I just had a question.

Oh well, I guess clinical time is what you make of it. It can be a excellent educational experience, or the longest 12 hrs of your life. The choice is yours alone.

Couldn't have said it better myself... it's what you make of it. You get out of it what you've put in.

[txemt]

I wanted to thank everyone who replied. I did get to see some interesting things in my ER rotation includinga trach and chest tube all on the same patient. The doctor who I worked with was great too. After we finished with the patient he asked me what I had learned and then quized me about procedures and what could have been done different i the field.