I am scared!!!!

[brock8024]

I know this has been covered a few times, but I never knew how bad the problem was. I chatted with a guy last night that is in paramedic school. We both live in Oklahoma and go to different schools. The school I go to will let me have a AAS degree in EMS Science. I think he can get one from his school to, but each teach different. My school is a national accredited school and is tough. We have 4 paramedic care classes. Our EKG and Pharm is not in those class but separate 3 hour college credit classes. Our program is probably one of the toughest in Oklahoma I think. I am not dogging that program but he said something to me that kind of scared me. He was like your program weeds out the week and only the strong survive. He is like ours work with the people to help them through. Now there is nothing wrong with that either but he was like you guys have to do a lot of extra things that we do not. Like give presentations and write papers. I do not understand why people would want to take the easy way out. I mean I am still realize that I will not know everything when I am done but how do we except to make more money when you have classes that are not tough and just give the bare minimum??

[Dustdevil]

I feel your pain, bro, but don't even get me started.

The ten-month program takes its time and works with the weak, but the two-year program is so intense that it weeds them out? Yeah, right. There's the very definition of a non-sequitor.

And by the way, the weak SHOULD BE weeded out.

I think my head is going to explode. :roll:

[Ridryder 911]

Welcome to the real world of EMS.. Yes, it is scary. I just finished a refresher for Paramedics at a service... I know they were supposed to be taught at one time, but I now do doubt that, there is now way one would forget so much. I don't want to hear any whiners about the NREMT test and exam and how hard it is, apparently after reviewing with some recent graduates and ones that just passed the exam, any person that can place their name on the test legibly must be able to pass. Ooops .. since it is going computer.. scratch that even. What scares me even more the science on the test is elementary to junior high level...

That is part of the problem.. again it is way too easy to be a Paramedic in the U.S. With this there will be associated high turn over rates, and dissatisfaction. With companies like EMSA feeding a training center, and basically telling what to teach and not to include (prevent further problems, like challenging the system) we in Oklahoma will have 2 distinct Paramedics: professional and technical.

R/r 911

[brock8024]

I mean i am not bragging on my program, but I guess I am. In my first semester it is only pt assessment. That is it 9 weeks of it, plus We had to give a 15 min presentation on professionalism and include world ems into it. Second semester is trauma and we had to write a 10 page paper over a issue in ems. I picked Fluid resuscitation. Third semester is medical stuff and fourth is peds and ob. I know in that last semester we have to go to a daycare for 8 hours just to see how kids act. We do not just get to stand around we actually have to interact with them. We started off with 35 or so in my first semester starting my third semester I think we will only have 15 or so. The program normally only graduates 3 to 10 a semester. I have talked to other emt's and medics that have worked with them from the other program and most said they did not now how to do a EKG.

[JPINFV]

The ten-month program takes its time and works with the weak, but the two-year program is so intense that it weeds them out? Yeah, right. There's the very definition of a non-sequitor.

It's possible. While not exactly the same thing, the bio program at my school (BS degree) spends the first 2 years weeding people out. Mostly because they don't have enough upper division labs to get everyone through in 4 years.

[NREMT-Basic]

It is a misconception that programs weed out the less qualified. The programs sets standards and those cannot meet them weed themselves out. Lets place credit where credit is do.

[VillageEMT]

I have talked to other emt's and medics that have worked with them from the other program and most said they did not now how to do a EKG.

Now that is scary. I'm only a Basic and I can set up a 12-lead EKG and read the more common indications from it. It is not something that is taught in the Basic class but my Squad expects a high level of "assisting the ALS provider." When there are only two of you in the back with a serious cardiac pt and a half hour ride to the ED the need to know what is going on with your pt is more important than the title on your certificate.

BTW The Masters program I took at NYU required a 50 to 100 page thesis (primary sources or original research only, no secondary sources) with a formal oral defense similar to a PhD dissertation and defense. Educational standards vary a great deal from place to place.

[MadMod]

Unfortunately, most areas will state that there is a "paramedic shortage". I work in one such area. There are many reasons for this, mainly the low pay versus the high work load.

But also, management tends to use circular logic with this problem (mostly to their advantage). Example: we have a high call volume. This results in a high work load per unit because there's not enough units. But we can't fill the trucks because there's not enough medics. There's not enough medics because of the low pay and high work load. And without enough trucks, we lose out on transfers, therefore there's not enough money for pay raises and to hire more medics. But there's a high work load because there's not enough medics for the units... And so on and so on. Upper management will spend hours discussing this, but not working towards solving it.

Our administrator came to the decision that the true problem lies in the fact the local paramedic program took 2 years to complete. This was because they were trying to teach excellence. He stated (in many meetings), we don't need excellence. We need a breathing patch-holder that can read the protocol book and show up on time. Goal number one: just try. That's all anyone expects.

He successfully lobbied this position to the other surrounding services. They then proceeded to convince the college board to lower the level of teaching or they would find somewhere else. So the college forced the program to go from 2 years to 10 months. And they were very unhappy with the 10 months. They wanted a start to finish time of 6 months.

Now we have new medics that are churned out with lower skill levels than every before. Most I wouldn't even characterize as "technical", just as what was wanted: "breathing".

[VillageEMT]

"6 months." :shock: My Basic course was four months (168 hours of class & 10 hours clinical)! The NYS Critical Care EMT is 10 months. EMT-P is two years, no ifs, ands or buts. Why don't they just admit that they are running a BLS service?

[brock8024]

My basic was 8 months long but we only went for one night a week for 5 hours. I liked it because it gave us time to study and the teacher more time to go in depth. We had to do 95 hours of ems clinical time. The instructors did not want there name mentioned with us if we could not function LOL. but that also helps because well of course more time on the truck as a student the more time u get to practice.

I think something needs to be done. I understand there is a shortage of medics but we do not see them herding nurses though a program because then need them. Why are we any different.

We need higher education for paramedics. That is why i disagree with I99 it is just a water down paramedic that services will use because they are cheaper to pay and things. I mean we are responsible for peoples lives and normally it is just u and ur partner making the calls and shots. so why not make the medic programs harder??