CISD for bystander CPR?

[dzmohr]

One of my former students actually had to perform CPR on a gentleman a few months ago, and needless to say, it was shocking and traumatizing for her to have had to actually apply what she had learned to someone who was, well.. dead. I spoke to her afterwards, assured her that she took appriopriate action and did all she could. Contrary to the informal 'study' dzmohr mentioned, instead of refusing to ever do CPR again, she was even more determined to take another update course so she could get her skills more polished (she messed up a bit due to shock) so she would doubt herself less should it happen again.

I think it's really important for bystanders who perform CPR to seek proper counselling necessary to move on after incidents such as this. From what she told me, the random shrink she saw was completely useless. Why? Because the person had no stories or anecdotes to relate to the situation. When she spoke to me or other people who have gone through similar situations before it was much easier for her to move past it because the advice and words came from people who knew where she was coming from.

This is what I am looking for... not how WE teach classes, not even so much how OUR students react. I would like to think that we who have done CPR and who know and can impart to our students what to expect - do exactly as portrayed here. Unfortunately among the "we" group of instructors I was talking about when I started this thread, EMS experienced instructors are the minority. By far most who take CPR classes, as has been noted in several threads here and elsewhere, are taught by instructors who have never seen a dead body let alone tried to resuscitate one. They are the instructors of the 7 of 10 I mentioned in my informal polling, study, whatever you want to call it. Also, as Geezlaweezy noted, after our post resuscitation by a minimum of 30 days interview MOST who had said they would not do it again reversed and many retrained as was his experience. I think he demonstrates well what I feel is needed but have no proof....I think someone in EMS should followup with anyone who has assisted with lay bystander CPR to offer any followup assistance they may ( or may not) need.

I am happy that some of you have NEVER had a patent's family who had a bad experience. I to have been in the field for a while ( since 1971) and my experience is quite different. Of course most express happiness that they did SOMETHING as opposed to nothing, and of course those taught by EMS instructors fared better then those instructed by those who left them unprepared. Evidently I am not the ONLY one who has noticed that some, without being able to have someone who has "been there" to talk to about it, do not fare so well.

With all due respect, is it possible, those who have "never seen a problem" have not had much exposure to family members 30+ days post code in an unsuccessful resuscitation. With the adrenaline pumping and hope at a high, dealing with immediate grief is it POSSIBLE more of your patient families who performed bystander CPR trained by other lay instructors inexperienced with resuscitation in the real world have problems that you do not know about.

I admit it is possible that I am the only one or one of the few but I think not.

By the way, I teach my students right too, I would appreciate it if we could back off the personal attacks and ridicule a bit and talk about the issue which in THIS thread I hope I have some say in --- yes I teach reality based CPR, no I am not an academic only instructor I have been on the street 30+ years too and I am NOT an idiot, but thanks for treating me as one, it is a very nice welcome indeed! Nice to see it is still a cannibalistic mentality when it comes to discussing issues. (Geezlaweezy this last part is NOT directed at you --- rather at the paragods with the 80 years of experience who think everyone is an idiot especially if they do not have the right letters after their name--- more especially if there are no Ps or RNs included )

If I am taking my welcome wrong I tender my apology now, but I note you guys play rough as I have been reading other threads! I miss the early days when we helped and collaborated with each other as we ALL learned from each other. WAY back before we knew EVERYTHING.

[8151]

Did you ever work out of Stn.51? How was Rampart. Just Kidding, I think that is really neat that you have/had been in the field since the early seventies. I have nothing but respect for those who have seen and experienced EMS change.

[geezlaweezy]

Actually, I'm not EMS. I was all set and ready to go this August into paramedicine when another opportunity arose, so EMS is temporarily being put off indefinately.

My experience comes from working in high risk facilities, and I have had unfortunate opportunities to deal with serious incidents and fatalities. I'm sure many here will shoot me down when I say this, but I think the problem with EMS personnel dealing with laypeople/bystanders is that yes, they are the ones who have the most knowledge with what to do in an emergency situation, and the most qualifiied to do so, WHEN they arrive on scene. What seems to be overlooked quite often, however, is that it is usually the bystander who has witnessed the traumatic incident or the first to arrive on scene. Seeing something happen vs. arriving after a call has been made is extremely different, so I've actually found that many EMS personnel are sometimes insensitive (unintentionally) to how the bystander is reacting or will react in the future. For you guys as professionals, you see this everyday, and bystanders obviously don't.

My main point is that my personal experience in dealing with my student is that I was able to relate, as a fellow bystander. I'm not quite sure how you guys deal with your students given a similar experience. I'm just telling the story from my point of view.

Cheers