do you carry anything when your off duty?

[dzmohr]

I just do not understand the reasoning behind stopping at MVAs when you are off duty. Yes we all have an obligation, and its nice to read of the stories in the paper about the off duty EMS professional that saved a life. Its not so nice to read about of same off-duty person with a wife and three kids being killed or injured while he was attempting to render care in a situation he was not prepared or equipped to handle.

I have been nearly killed a few times at MVAs while on duty and thats with a ambulance with flashing lights, two or three engines with flashing lights, local police, state police, all with flashing lights. I cant understand the reasoning behind it. I might have an obligation, I also have an obligation to my family, not to be killed in a roadside accident that I have no business being at.

I don't take risks on duty, why would I ever take them while off duty.

I am not driven by the fear of litigation, however when you are not equipped and prepared as you are while on duty. You will mis-step and when every Tom, Dick and Harry with a cell phone equipped with a video camera is looking for the money shot, you should tread lightly. You might have the best interest of the pt at hand, however I can assure you the twelve-person jury of your peers in the civil suit also will, and they probably wont be driven by what your initial interests were.

So do yourself a favor stay in your car in the traffic and let the pt wait the five minutes for the on duty crew to arrive, just like everyone else has to.

I have paid accidental death and dismemberment premiums to long to let my insurance company off the hook by being killed while off-duty.

Damn, Whit!!!! What's up??? Your Avatar shows some blood flow to the brain, but did you use it before you typed this??

( Slow down, I am only teasing, though I do SEVERELY disagree with you!) You do sound a bit harsh and judgemental in a lot of posts, but then aren't we all at times. Most of us are passion driven...that is not ALWAYS bad. At least you have a position and you speak it.

Let me ask you this, I am driving near your house, you and your family have just been in a MAJOR MVA right in front of me! You appear unconscious but your wife and three kids are trapped in the car trying to get out, obviously panicked and there is smoke and flame showing under the hood, do I follow your advise call 911, stay in my car and keep driving or stop, use my extinguisher and see what I can do to help your wife and kids ( leaving you alone to wait 20 minutes for the delayed response due to traffic, since that is your expressed wish from this post.)?

I am not asking this to bait you, do not answer, please, without visualizing the situation I have described and answer honestly.

Actually, I AM asking you this to bait you but let's see where it goes...just know I want to finish the thread when we are done as friends, I do respect your position and I am NOT advocating stopping if it is not safe to do so.

[whit72]

dzmohr wrote:

Let me ask you this, I am driving near your house, you and your family have just been in a MAJOR MVA right in front of me! You appear unconscious but your wife and three kids are trapped in the car trying to get out, obviously panicked and there is smoke and flame showing under the hood, do I follow your advise call 911, stay in my car and keep driving or stop, use my extinguisher and see what I can do to help your wife and kids ( leaving you alone to wait 20 minutes for the delayed response due to traffic, since that is your expressed wish from this post.)?

First, I am sorry if you find my post judgmental. As I stated MOST are not prepared or equipped to handle the situation. I have been driving for almost twenty-years and in that time I have never come across a situation in which you describe. Yes, I would be thrilled if you stopped to assist my family from a burning vehicle. Would I expect you to? No.

What I don't want is innocent people being injured tending to injured parties without the equipment necessary to do it safely and effectively. I might have two trucks responding for the three reported injuries then you are injured in the process. I now need additional resources which in turn delays the care and transportation of the originally injured. Not to mention your vehicle is probably parked in an area and does not have the proper notification system to properly alert passing motorists to its position, they are to busy watching, and taking pictures of the bystander rendering care. SMASH, CRASH, BOOM, more injuries, more resources, now although your intentions were good you have completely stripped my area of available units that could be handling other emergencies. If you think this is far fetched it isn't I have had motorists smash into fire trucks, my ambulance, the guy in front of them, the crowd that has gathered to watch the show.

This was not a personal attack on people who stop to render care in life threating situations as you described. Yes, put the fire out, now you notice one is critical do you have the resources to handle c-spine stabilization, and airway maintenance simultaneously? Which do you neglect. Yes your original intentions were true, however now you find yourself in a situation you can not possibly handle alone. So you do the best you can, re align and clear the airway and spontaneous respirations return, however your actions may not have directly caused a cervical spine fx, however there is one present.

Do you think people will just let that slide and just thank you for saving their loved ones life? No. Because the lawyer everyone has on retainer will place the blame solely on you. You should have known, you are trained, oh your educated even better, then you should have definitely known. That lawyer will have a field day with you. Its sad but its the world we live in, you have to take that into account.

[Richard B the EMT]

I mention that I have, and will again, stop at street scenes. I probably did not state, but thought I implied, stop in as safe a manner as possible. I mentioned that my ol' Olds was hit in the rear twice, despite having all those emergency lights activated, what I called my "E" lights.

Remember, nothing is a sure bet. A little more than 10 years ago, a driver decided to ignore a lane closure on a local main roadway, full of Fire units, Police cars, and an ambulance attending to a 2 car accident, and ran into the crew and patient being loaded.

The patient was backboarded, so obviously he couldn't jump clear, and the 2 EMTs were actually loading him into the ambulance. The EMTs were pinned between the speeding car's bumper, and the step-bumper of the type one ambulance.

I never knew the final status of the patient, but one of the EMTs has, now, limited usage of her legs, and the other one died at the Trauma Center on the surgical table. That EMT, Christopher Prescott, was the first EMT of the New York City EMS to die in the line of duty.

In this and other incidences, even when on duty, things can and do happen. Just make sure that you use all possible precautions when on a scene, on or off duty.