If you are a Paramedic, will you work in an ALS service BLS

[johnrsemtp]

Confusing topic I know but I will try to make it easier:

I am a paramedic, working for a private ALS Service: today I was asked to come in and help cover shifts, but was told that they didn't have enough ALS stocked trucks so I would to have to work on a BLS level.

Would you do it? During medic school our class followed 2 or 3 lawsuits happening across the country where paramedics did that and were sued because a pt crashed or needed ALS procedures that were not able to be done by the paramedic due to being BLS that day. 2 the patient/family won, 1 the medic won because he was working at a BLS provider part time.

just curious of peoples thoughts on this.

[Malignant-Hyperthermia]

2 the patient/family won,

Thats very interesting........

Im just curious why they couldn't dredge enough supplies out of the store room for just one day?

My understanding of medical negligence is that in order for the plaintiff to prove negligence they have to be able to prove that the actions/inaction of the provider was the reason the patient died, and NOT their injuries/condition....

Regardless of weather or not the position filled was by a BLS officer or a paramedic, despatach sent a BLS truck anyway - so either way the patient was getting a BLS level of care

From the info you have given, sounds like a pretty dodgy decision on behalf of th beak

[stcommodore]

If you treated within your scope and only had limited equipment and did what you could with that eqipment how could you be wrong? Lets change the secene, say your a medic at a MCI and while your without ETI supplies you insert an OPA and intubation doesn't take place until the hospital. While the patient dies for whatever reason, you did what you could with what you had. I don't think its unheard of for medics to work for BLS squads that have no licence for ALS services, but if said service has a licenced medic truck and not enough medic supplies to have it service as such I would think the fault would fall to them and not the provider.

[tniuqs]

Short answer for me...NOT A HOPE IN HELL I would work this way.

[JakeEMTP]

Some of our medics will work on a BLS truck. They aren't overly concerned about being sued since they are on said BLS truck, that is the level they function as.

If it is a basic truck, doing basic calls, they are functioning as a basic. Yes, they are EMT-Paramedics, but functioning as a EMT- Basic and document as such.

I hope this makes sense to you, because it confuses me!

I have to agree with tniuqs though. I don't think I would want to do it.

[Malignant-Hyperthermia]

Short answer for me...NOT A HOPE IN HELL I would work this way.

Is this because of the legalitites or because you would get so damn frustrated knowing there are more interventions you could use and not have them available?

Cause that would annoy the crap outta me!

P.S. i know that came off wrong, but i just came off a night shift, and my brain wont function properly

[johnrsemtp]

I know that if I was working on a BLS Truck I would be working on a BLS level; BUT I would still be a medic: If I was dispatched on a pt that was deemed BLS, such as 2 weeks ago: Altered Mental Status, BLS non emergent due to the fact that it had been going on for 3 days and the V/S were stable: got there V/S were 6 days old, and pt's b/p was 72/40. as a medic on a medic truck : O2, started 2 large IV's, O2, monitor blood glucose checked and transported. closest ED was 20 min away.

If I was on a BLS truck that day, on an ALS service: all I could do was O2 and go. if the pt died enroute (in some areas this has happened; Iowa, Florida and washington state); I could be sued because I was not working at my level, and I allowed it to happen to me. ALso the services would be sued because they had me working BLS, and I have even heard that the Medical Director can be sued, because he allowed it to happen (and he has deeper pockets); but I have not seen that for sure.

[Guest CHP medic]

If they we're paying overtime I'd do it. A majority of calls can be handled BLS anyway, but it would be frusterating having a hand tied behind your back.

[medic001918]

If you treated within your scope and only had limited equipment and did what you could with that eqipment how could you be wrong? Lets change the secene, say your a medic at a MCI and while your without ETI supplies you insert an OPA and intubation doesn't take place until the hospital. While the patient dies for whatever reason, you did what you could with what you had. I don't think its unheard of for medics to work for BLS squads that have no licence for ALS services, but if said service has a licenced medic truck and not enough medic supplies to have it service as such I would think the fault would fall to them and not the provider.

An MCI falls under an entirely different set of circumstances than the routine 911 call. So the rules don't apply.

I wouldn't work the shift. I'm trained as a paramedic and employed as one, that makes me expected to perform as one.

Shane

NREMT-P

[Dustdevil]

If they we're paying overtime I'd do it. A majority of calls can be handled BLS anyway, but it would be frusterating having a hand tied behind your back.

Word. I have my price. If they want to pay me time and a half medic's pay to run a transfer truck, I don't have a serious problem with that. Somebody's gotta do it, and I could use the relaxation. It would certainly have the potential for some frustration if a serious patient presented, but hey... I have yet to work a day in EMS without frustration, so I can hang. I did it for many years on part-time, event stand-by gigs.

I have some real doubts about the relevance of those lawsuits you supposedly heard about. There must have been some more factors that we don't know about. A provider cannot be held liable for an employers choice of equipment levels. That's just not even happening. Not to mention, I don't know many medics who have anything worth taking even if they were found liable.

Can you get back to us with some details to clarify this?