Texas at it again

[Asysin2leads]

Asysin2leads, I have been respectful and far from paranoid. I have agreed with some of your points and I never mentioned minorities or discussed the middle east in relation to the topic. In addition, I never mentioned my personal view on politics or gun magazines. I think we can disagree and still respect each other.

Take care,

chbare.

I wasn't referring to you, chbare, I was referring to Engine54 up there with his "The media is out to get me and my gun!" ramblings.

[Andrewtx]

You what's really funny, is in the war on terror, the loud, flag waving gun toting types are the ones doing the most to make sure the terrorists win. From supporting the oil cartels, to making sure that its easier for Muhammed and Akbar to get an assault rifle or sneak a concealed weapon into your neighborhood shopping mall, these reactionary scumbags are the ones who will have the blood on their hands . . .

Actually, sir, the terrorists are the ones who will have the blood on their hands.

[Asysin2leads]

You're right, the gun toting, religious zealots who are intolerant of other's beliefs will have blood on their hands.

[CBEMT]

Here's what really happens when people carry concealed:

Ah, a real dye-in-the-wool gun-grabber shows his true, however uneducated, stripes.

Citizens with guns prevent or stop crimes every day, all over this country.

Your personal issues with guns don't make this any less true.

[Asysin2leads]

Ah, a real dye-in-the-wool gun-grabber shows his true, however uneducated, stripes.

Citizens with guns prevent or stop crimes every day, all over this country.

Crimes like making too much noise or parking the wrong spot, perhaps. Ever heard of the the word "Truthiness?" that's when you "know" something to be true despite what the facts say. You can call me all the names you want, your arguments will still fall short.

[CBEMT]

Crimes like making too much noise or parking the wrong spot, perhaps. Ever heard of the the word "Truthiness?" that's when you "know" something to be true despite what the facts say. You can call me all the names you want, your arguments will still fall short.

I've got facts, what do you have?

44,000 to 98,000 Americans die each year not from the medical conditions they checked in with, but from preventable medical errors. Doctors are a preventable medical problem that guns could never dream of being!

http://www.fda.gov/fdac/features/2000/500_err.html

But we should stick to the topic. I just find that one fun.

Analyzing county level data for the entire United States from 1977 to 2000, we find annual reductions in murder rates between 1.5 and 2.3 percent for each additional year that a right-to-carry law is in effect. For the first five years that such a law is in effect, the total benefit from reduced crimes usually ranges between about $2 billion and $3 billion per year.

http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=372361

Guns used 2.5 million times a year in self-defense. Law-abiding citizens use guns to defend themselves against criminals as many as 2.5 million times every year -- or about 6,850 times a day.1 This means that each year, firearms are used more than 80 times more often to protect the lives of honest citizens than to take lives.2

1 Gary Kleck and Marc Gertz, "Armed Resistance to Crime: The Prevalence and Nature of Self-Defense With a Gun," 86 The Journal of Criminal Law and Criminology, Northwestern University School of Law, 1 (Fall 1995):164.

2 According to the National Safety Council, the total number of gun deaths (by accidents, suicides and homicides) account for less than 30,000 deaths per year. See Injury Facts, published yearly by the National Safety Council, Itasca, Illinois.

During the first fifteen years that the Florida law was in effect, alligator attacks outpaced the number of crimes committed by carry holders by a 229 to 155 margin.

And even the 155 "crimes" committed by concealed carry permit holders are somewhat misleading as most of these infractions resulted from Floridians who accidentally carried their firearms into restricted areas, such as an airport.

John R. Lott, Jr., "Right to carry would disprove horror stories," Kansas City Star, (July 12, 2003).

Armed citizens kill more crooks than do the police. Citizens shoot and kill at least twice as many criminals as police do every year (1,527 to 606). And readers of Newsweek learned that "only 2 percent of civilian shootings involved an innocent person mistakenly identified as a criminal. The 'error rate' for the police, however, was 11 percent, more than five times as high."

Kleck, Point Blank: Guns and Violence in America, (1991):111-116, 148.

George F. Will, "Are We 'a Nation of Cowards'?," Newsweek (15 November 1993):93.

"What we can say with some confidence is that allowing more people to carry guns does not cause an increase in crime. In Florida, where 315,000 permits have been issued, there are only five known instances of violent gun crime by a person with a permit. This makes a permit-holding Floridian the cream of the crop of law-abiding citizens, 840 times less likely to commit a violent firearm crime than a randomly selected Floridian without a permit."

http://www.davekopel.com/2A/OpEds/More_Per..._Less_Crime.htm

Citizen Self-Defense Blog

http://www.claytoncramer.com/gundefenseblog/blogger.html

Anecdotal evidence technically, but I thought you'd like to see some examples outside of statistical studies. Even so, such media reports are extremely rare: Outgunned: How the Network News Media Are Spinning the Gun Control Debate

I've got plenty more, but you get the idea.

Not that I expect to sway you one bit- those who yell the loudest about being open-minded usually aren't.

[Scaramedic]

Can we please drop the stereotypes A2L, I am sorry you have this attitude that all southerners are just simple minded hicks with a beer in one hand and their sister in the other. Do you really believe everyone from the south who has a carry license is an ignorant redneck? I am sure that some of the people who work for such redneck magnets as NASA & Boeing will be among those with concealed weapons at home. The fact is that ignorance and prejudice are everywhere, even in this very forum everytime you stereotype a large part of this country with your comments.

The people of Texas who might carry guns are normal people, they live in the burbs and have normal jobs. They do not live in fear of anyone, they just want protection in case something terrible happens. To be honest I have been all over this country and by far the most paranoid people I have ever met are from major urban areas along the east coast. I have never seen such rude & paranoid people as I have seen in cities like New York and Boston.

My wife and many of my friends are from the South, they are all good people and extremely intelligent. My wife still says Hi to strangers when she walks down the street even though that is very foreign to most west coasters.

Please drop the Bubba stereotypes and I will not start with the New Yorker stereotype of an uptight businessman with a latte in one hand and a PDA with the number of a crack addicted transvestite in his favorites in the other.

:wink:

Peace,

Marty

[Andrewtx]

Can we please drop the stereotypes A2L, I am sorry you have this attitude that all southerners are just simple minded hicks with a beer in one hand and their sister in the other. Do you really believe everyone from the south who has a carry license is an ignorant redneck? I am sure that some of the people who work for such redneck magnets as NASA & Boeing will be among those with concealed weapons at home. The fact is that ignorance and prejudice are everywhere, even in this very forum everytime you stereotype a large part of this country with your comments.

The people of Texas who might carry guns are normal people, they live in the burbs and have normal jobs. They do not live in fear of anyone, they just want protection in case something terrible happens. To be honest I have been all over this country and by far the most paranoid people I have ever met are from major urban areas along the east coast. I have never seen such rude & paranoid people as I have seen in cities like New York and Boston.

My wife and many of my friends are from the South, they are all good people and extremely intelligent. My wife still says Hi to strangers when she walks down the street even though that is very foreign to most west coasters.

Please drop the Bubba stereotypes and I will not start with the New Yorker stereotype of an uptight businessman with a latte in one hand and a PDA with the number of a crack addicted transvestite in his favorites in the other.

:wink:

Peace,

Marty

Great post. Asys certainly isn't painting a caricature of the Texas I grew up in -- a place whose residents are much friendlier, and also less paranoid, than the sophisticated elites here in DC. In fact, of those I knew growing up who either carried a weapon or owned firearms that weren't merely packed away in a box somewhere, nearly all were intelligent professionals who seemed perfectly competent to responsibly keep and carry a firearm. How they are aiding terrorists I haven't a clue, who I'm sure don't need the protection of the second amendment to attack a civilian target. :roll:

[Eng542ine]

Asys...

Talk about stereotyping!! Talk about being WRONG!!

1) I am not, nor have I ever been a member of the republican party.

2) I am not, nor have I ever been a member of the National Rifle Association.

You, sir, have just shown yourself for the ignorant ass that you must be. "Anyone that doesn't agree with me MUST be one of THEM"

As far as paranoia goes, it doesn't live here. It doesn't even vacation here! Funny how disturbed you get when people disagree with your line of thought, as rational as the "opposition" may be...

One moment, I'm just another Paramedic, the next I'm a fear-mongering, paranoid, anti-gay, anti-communist, NRA member, and... GASP... A REPUBLICAN!! Funny, I'm none of the above, not even close! Silly me, I thought this nice, respectful, little exchange of ideas was just a group of ADULT PROFESSIONALS exercising their right to free speech, their freedom of independent thought, and just basically exchanging ideas and positions. Then, BAM, out of nowhere comes one that insists on being EXTREMELY juvenile and defensive... next thing you know he starts with the libel.

I respect your right to disagree with me, as much as I appreciate being able to express my opinions and thoughts in this open forum without encountering what amounts to a personal attack.

So, grow up... just grow up...

[Michael]

Aw, just shoot him.