Does BLS call for ALS intercept when not needed....

[scratrat]

Funnier???

[BushyFromOz]

**realises how awesome aussie ems is**

[Timmy]

**realises how awesome aussie ems is**

[Leener77]

I work in NJ where all ambulances are BLS and ALS are only dispatched for certain calls or if needed. Some ambulance companies are largely volly based. I work for one that is all paid and also for one that is part paid staff, part volley. In my experience I have seen that there are some EMT's that are VERY 'medic dependent', and some that have NO clue if/when to call for medics if they haven't already been dispatched. Or may not know if they need to be recalled. I'm not sure what the problem is.......are these EMT's not being educated properly or do they have no common sense? Or both maybe? I personally am pretty confident as to weather or not I need medics. A PT is either sick or not sick and can be managed by BLS. Or if I have any doubt in my mind or a gut feeling, I won't recall them or call them out if they haven't been dispatched. Some medics get pissy that they actually have to do their job, but most are okay with coming out and at least just check the Pt and if they aren't needed, they'll release to BLS. I have recalled medics many times simply because they were not needed. It's sad we have EMT's that are clueless when it comes to PT care and what kind of care a PT needs but I guess if that's the case, then i'd rather have them get medics and and be told they aren't needed after Pt assessment, then for them NOT to call when they are needed and the Pt suffers because of it........better to be safe then sorry in a case like that I suppose. But if an EMT isn't confident enough in their own skills to make a call like that, they shouldn't be on a truck doing Pt care......period! And you sure can't assume your partner will know, cause they may be as clueless as the next person.

.......and that's all I got to say bout that.......

[JPINFV]

What else do you expect with 120 hours of training AND a low call volume area?

[Leener77]

I suppose, but I have been an EMT-B for 6 years now have only been on the street part time for less then 2 years. For a while I was only volunteering about once a week. Then I got a job working once a week (paid) in an area that has a very low call volume as well. So on an average I only work twice a week and that's just in the last 8 months.......but I feel confident that I can make the call as to if I need medics or not.....some are questionable sure....but if I have any doubt, I'll get medics just to be on the safe side. And I'm far from 'medic dependent'. And I do understand that as a new EMT, you need to gain some experience to be able to make those kind of calls. I'm not referring to anyone specifically, but I do personally know people.....that work even more then me & have been EMT's longer then me......that are still clueless and I simply don't understand why. It's BLS.....not rocket science. So basically I'm not disagreeing with you......just giving my point of view. It does have a lot to do with how much experience an EMT has and what grasp they have on BLS care. Does that make sense?

[zippyRN]

I definitely agree there! They are not qualified to drive. Not sure where in all that bandaging and splinting training they acquired the belief that they were qualfied to take my life in their hands behind the wheel, but that is another delusion. Even if they had a whole weekend [sarcasm] of EVOC thrown in there to boot, you've got to show me a lot more than a 120 hour first aid course before you are going to chauffeur me around the city streets with lights and sirens and adrenaline pumping through your veins. So yeah, EMT-Bs definitely are not driver material.

in the evil socialised medicine world of rightpondia Ambulance Service Emergency Drivers spend 120 hours on driver training alonge on top of the 150 -200 or so hours for middle teir or 250 -350 hours for the tech grade of training. Thiose driveing for the volunteer sector are assessed against the standards so often wil spend similar amounts of time on driver training and similar amounts oif added up time on clinical training, needless to say there are none emergency patient transport crew or first aiders with extended roles who have more than 120 hours of clinical training ...

I have to agree with Jon. If EMT-B's are so ignorant that all they are good for is driving why do we have them? I try very hard not to take any of this personally but sometimes it gets a little tough when all you do is say that the only one who can save a patient is a medic.

Please find me one single quote from here where anybody said anything even remotely approaching that silly statement. It hasn't happened. And your failure to see and think this through rationally does nothing to make anybody feel more comfortable that you are a critical thinker, qualfied to assume responsibility for the lives of our most vulnerable citizens.

[nc_ems_chick]

I work for a BLS service. We run basic level calls for non emergent services as well as back up for our local county service which is ALS. We also are expanded scope too! Most of the time we dont get ALS calls but sometimes your routine bls call will turn to an als in a blink of an eye. I have only had an intercept ONCE.. and it was duely needed. I make the decision if I need one or if i proceed routine or 10-18 (emergency traffic) to the local hospital. Just because I am not a medic does not mean I dont have knowledge or experience than some of the medics out there. I have known medics who basically shit their pants in situations that some basics have excelled in!

[JPINFV]

1. Welcome to the city.

2.

Just because you seem to be better than 1 or 2 medics doesn't validate BLS over ALS. No one should pat themselves on their back because they can do their job. I do not claim to be a good basic because I've called medics x amount of times or not called medics x amount of times. As long as my assessments and actions meets the medical needs of the patient to the best of my scope, the rest are just numbers.

[medic001918]

I work for a BLS service. We run basic level calls for non emergent services as well as back up for our local county service which is ALS. We also are expanded scope too! Most of the time we dont get ALS calls but sometimes your routine bls call will turn to an als in a blink of an eye. I have only had an intercept ONCE.. and it was duely needed. I make the decision if I need one or if i proceed routine or 10-18 (emergency traffic) to the local hospital. Just because I am not a medic does not mean I dont have knowledge or experience than some of the medics out there. I have known medics who basically shit their pants in situations that some basics have excelled in!

First of all, who brought this thread back to life? It was dead and I kind of wish it stayed that way. But on to some other things. Yes, BLS calls an turn in the blink of an eye as you say. What exactly defines "expanded scope?" We don't have that classification where I'm from so I don't know what it entails. And more importantly, how often do you find yourself functioning in that skill set?

I'm glad you make the decision of if you need an ALS intercept or not. That's exactly what your job is. I'm not totally sure where you were going with that.

As for the "just becaus I'm not a medic..." comment, I don't doubt that you probably have experience. In fact, you may have more experience than some medics out there. As far as the knowledge, where did it come from? If you have the knowledge, why not go become a medic and put that knowledge to use? I find it hard to believe that you have the same knowledge base without having attended a paramedic program or some other kind of training. CME's will only go so far.

There are medics that find themselves overwhelmed in certain situations. That's an issue that should be dealt with by dealing with the provider. It's great that a BLS provider excelled in it. Again, their job is to handle stressful situations. Rather than patting a BLS provider for performing as they're expected to, maybe the medic that "shit" his pants needs to be remediated and handled for poor job performance. I'm not overly impressed by a BLS provider who doesn't get worked up. I expect that out of the people that I work with since I expect them to hold themselves to the same job performance standard for their scope as I hold myself to in my scope or practice.

Shane

NREMT-P