A call to arms! EMT-B's defend yourself!

[Dustdevil]

Wow. :shock:

I don't think I have ever seen anybody so thoroughly ruin their own credibility in one post here before. And then to repeat it two more times? I'm stunned. I thought this chick actually knew what she was talking about before now.

A reputation is a terrible thing to waste. :?

[chbare]

As I understand, many of the 2 year programs require pre/co-req classes in addition to the core paramedic program.

As Ridryder911 stated, it is hard to appreciate another profession without actually being part of that profession. I honestly thought that I was a step ahead of everybody and that Nursing school was just a simple consumer of my time. I thought this because I honestly thought my EMT-B & CNA training prepared me to work as a Nurse. Heck, I even had ACLS, so I knew what color of box to open and push when presented with a strange squiggly line on the monitor. I simply did not know any better and EMS culture seems to accept and nurture this attitude in many areas. My first semester of school was long, horrific, and humbling.

As I learned and matured as a provider, my views on skills changed as well. As a basic I thought "RSI, cool they taught me that in a 1/2 hour lecture in PHTlS, I can do that and cannot wait to do that." Now, many years later, when I arrive on the scene of a bad patient and think RSI, I pucker up and think "oh God, this could be bad." Why the change in thinking. I have learned to realize that medicine is complex and patients rarely present like the cool scenarios in the EMT book and act like the patients in the skills stations. A comprehensive educational experience is crucial to develop a good understanding of how the human reacts to illness and how our interventions effect the patient.

Take care,

chbare.

[Dustdevil]

I honestly thought that I was a step ahead of everybody and that Nursing school was just a simple consumer of my time. I thought this because I honestly thought my EMT-B & CNA training prepared me to work as a Nurse. Heck, I even had ACLS, so I knew what color of box to open and push when presented with a strange squiggly line on the monitor. I simply did not know any better and EMS culture seems to accept and nurture this attitude in many areas.

Very true. The pervasive EMS culture in this country does ineed promote this nonsense heavily. Apparently, EMS is overpopulated with people with very fragile egos that need a lot of positive strokes to validate themselves. When one has little intelligence, little education, and a job that really amounts to nothing more than blue collar labour, one needs copious amounts of smoke blown in order to obscure that pitiful reality from sight. Out of sight, out of mind. But the interesting thing about EMS is that so many people blow their own smoke!

Be afraid. Be very afraid.

[PRPGfirerescuetech]

Egamukayshun gows aye lonnnnnnnnj waiz.

One thing I picked up on this lovely thread was........

USE SPELL CHECK :roll:

[EMT*Sweet]

First, keep in mind that I didnt say that Basics should be able to start IV's or push meds. I said they should be upgraded which of course would call for more education. An upgrade would be to an "IV" or Intermediate status.

The original post was addressed for Basics to defend themselves and/or their place. I think I successfully did this. We dont demean infants for crawling before they can walk and we shouldnt demean EMT-B's before they can reach a higher level of training. Therefore there should be no room for anyone to defend themselves against the higher ups. Basics may not be able to start an IV but they can cover a vast number of tasks on any scene as well as in the back of a truck. All in all, this alone frees the (my opinion only for most cases/ not all but most) one medic to do what he/she needs to do. Am I right on this?

RID~ I wasnt challenging or comparing the knowledge base from a Basic or Intermediate level to that of a medic. Also, I may have used the wrong terminology but that isnt a point I am trying to validate nor am I speaking about you, your knowledge or abilities. None of that is in question!

Here is another question. If it should become mandatory for two medics to be paired on a truck then wouldnt that erase the basic level? If so how can it be justified that I person go all the way thru medic school without having actual hands on patient care. Is that more beneficial than a person beginning as a Basic and not being looked down on while they perfect those skills before moving on to the next level of patient care?

[Dustdevil]

Am I right on this?

Since you asked, no. You are incorrect on each and every point you covered in your last two (four if you count the repeats) posts. Not even in the ballpark.

Here is another question. If it should become mandatory for two medics to be paired on a truck then wouldnt that erase the basic level?

Nope. It would only erase them from ambulances. They would still exist on fire trucks.

If so how can it be justified that I person go all the way thru medic school without having actual hands on patient care.

Hmmm... I have never seen a paramedic school, nursing school, medical school, PA school, RT school, phlebotomy school, CNA school, x-ray school, or any other medical profession school besides EMT-B school that didn't graduate with considerable hands-on patient care experience. I suppose your school probably sucked arse, but that wasn't a professional school either. Just a little EMT course. Paramedics DO have hands on patient care experience before graduation. It is a DOT requirement. If you had ever gone to one, you would know this. Although, most of them should add a lot more patient time than they currently have.

Is that more beneficial than a person beginning as a Basic and not being looked down on while they perfect those skills before moving on to the next level of patient care?

Read carefully, n00b. Apparently you missed it the first 57,000 times it was posted here...

[marq=left:644adfb131][align=center:644adfb131]IT IS NOT ABOUT SKILLS!!![/align:644adfb131][/marq:644adfb131]

If your vast "hands on" experience has not yet brought you to that realisation, then obviously your experience is suspect. As is your education.

[EMT*Sweet]

:shock: Well if that wasnt an ass kickin I dont know what was

Gotta love the dominance. Let me rest up and I'll be back for another round..

[pyroknight]

Okay, Dust. I am going to stick my head up out of the foxhole here. I would argue it is not about skills OR education - it is about having skills proficiency AND the knowledge (acquired through both education AND experience) to know when to apply those skills.

I would rather have a paramedic than a cardiologist insert my IV catheter ANY day. If, heaven forbid, someone I cared about needed intubation, I would absolutely prefer that a paramedic be called upon to perform that skill over a dermatologist. The dermatologist has A LOT more education than the paramedic and he studied all aspects of A&P in medical school, but he does not have the competency in the skill of intubation required to have a respectable likelihood of success.

There will always be those individuals who will do the absolute minimum at whatever level they are at. I have told the story on here before of my paramedic partner back when I was an intermediate who rifled through the drug box frantically looking for the Narcan. I reached over and handed him the naloxone and had to firmly reassure him that it was indeed the generic form of the narcotic reversal medication that he was searching for. Education does not ensure competence.

BLS transports should be handled by BLS-staffed AMBULANCES. It is a tremendous waste of resources in many systems to have two highly educated, highly trained paramedics trucking granny back and forth to the MRI suite. Every patient should be evaluated by a paramedic, NP, PA, DO, MD, or the like. Those who need continued advanced level care should be transported by ALS, those who need a horizontal taxi can go BLS.

[AnthonyM83]

Just stating that "medics are medics, because of the drugs they push" just illustrated ignorance of the job, the role, and the education required. Again, you can't compare or even evaulate if you are not one.

I'm not defending her, but since this is true the thread was setup for failure for the beginning, because EMTB are thus not able to defend themselves having only been on the BLS side.

[AnthonyM83]

This is a discussion board. If disagreeing is 'being slammed,' than you've come to the wrong place. If I wanted to discuss something where I knew that the other person would agree with me 100% of the time, than I would try talking to a mirror instead of a computer screen showing a discussion board.

Naw, people do definitely get slammed her. There's definitel ya difference between disagreeing and slamming someone. Check out Dust's response, for example. Not saying whether it's warranted or not...but slammage definitely does happen here