Nurses working in EMS system?

[Dustdevil]

Let me give you some perpective on the Dutch system:

I hate it when he does this. It makes me feel so damn inadequate. :?

I just saw an interesting commercial on CNN. A Johnson & Johnson sponsored commercial promoting this website showed three different nurses portrayed in action. One of them was bagging an intubated patient in the back of a rolling ambulance. Another was kneeling beside a motorcycle accident victim on a highway. Only one of the three was in a hospital. I have to admit that I am far removed from nursing politics these days, so I don't know if there is some current initiative to push nursing into a bigger EMS role. Quite probably, the commercial was just sensationalising nursing to appeal to those people who would never consider the field because it is stereotyped as boring by most. Regardless, it is interesting.

Be afraid!

[hammerpcp]

I hate it when he does this. It makes me feel so damn inadequate. :?

I thought you would be accustomed to feeling inadequate by now.

I just saw an interesting commercial on CNN. A Johnson & Johnson sponsored commercial promoting this website showed three different nurses portrayed in action. One of them was bagging an intubated patient in the back of a rolling ambulance. Another was kneeling beside a motorcycle accident victim on a highway. Only one of the three was in a hospital. I have to admit that I am far removed from nursing politics these days, so I don't know if there is some current initiative to push nursing into a bigger EMS role. Quite probably, the commercial was just sensationalising nursing to appeal to those people who would never consider the field because it is stereotyped as boring by most. Regardless, it is interesting.

Be afraid!

Oh I am. I live in constant fear. :shock:

[DwayneEMTP]

I'm curious about something in the nurse/medic debate...

In our ACLS class (two day) there were 10 medics/4 nurses.

7 medics passed/ 0 nurses passes.

PALS 10 medics/ 3 nurses

6 medics passed/ 0 nurses passed.

Our medic class had no special prep for these courses, the nurses had just as much notice as we did of the upcoming classes, perhaps more as they were organized by the hospital...

I'm fully on board with the difference between the educations, some of my study buddies are nurses...so what gives?

Dwayne

[Ridryder 911]

Wow !

That is surprising since really no one should "ever fail" an AHA ACLS or even PALS course. There is usually remediation scheduled immediately afterwards, and most courses now have a "no fail" type policy, since there is really no certification in such, rather one attended an AHA ACLS event.

As well, it appears they had crappy instructors in the ACLS. The main intent of the new AHA ACLS is not to see failure or place pressure. Was there a 'strict megacode"? If so, they are teaching using the past methodology. How hard is AHA ACLS? Show the video, perform a cardiac arrest station, airway is OP's, NP's, Combitube or LMA (intubation is no longer even taught or tested) some very basic ECG's (v-tach, blocks, aystole, fib) a written exam (that can be retested), that is about it.

Even our X-ray tech scored a 96% on the written, and they never had any cardiac training. ... Sorry, something smells wrong.

I might inquire was these ER nurses or ICU nurses, or were they general med surg, O.B. or surgery nurses. Remember, critical care and emergency specialization is NOT part of the general curriculum for nursing. It is a speciality, with that one takes special courses such to be competent in that area.

Still, I have not seen anyone fail AHA ACLS in about two years. Remediation, usually clarrifies the problem (usually instructor fails to emphasize) and megacodes are very calm, checklist performance. Again, airway is just a teaching station, with repeat performance.

Curious.. Is this from the same group that taught your Paramedic and emphasized treating PVC's and use of Lidocaine?...

R/r 911

[DwayneEMTP]

Curious.. Is this from the same group that taught your Paramedic and emphasized treating PVC's and use of Lidocaine?...

I'm not sure what you're asking here...

Dwayne

[EMT*Sweet]

I see nothing wrong with having nurses in the EMS field as long as they have recieved adequate training in PreHospital care . Far to many have absolutley no clue as to what to do with a patient until a Doc gives them orders.... Can't imagine some of the ER RN's I have run across hopping up in the back of an ambulance and doing anything useful. This in no way is intended to insult nurses. I am looking forward to becoming one myself but in the case of working emergency I feel part of their training should come from actually working in the EMS field so they can see how things work from the beginning.

[Dustdevil]

This in no way is intended to insult nurses. I am looking forward to becoming one myself but in the case of working emergency I feel part of their training should come from actually working in the EMS field so they can see how things work from the beginning.

I have never, ever in my career, heard an RN of ANY education or experience level mouthing off about how they could/should work EMS without some extra education and training in pre-hospital care. Never heard one trying to find a way to get around the additional requirements. All that I know of went at least to EMT-B school at a minimum, and many of them went to full paramedic schools rather than challenging the exam. You simply don't see this "I don't need all that book learnin'" mentality in nursing.

On the other hand, almost every paramedic I have ever heard mouthing off about being able to work in the hospital was contending that they were adequately prepared to do so with no more educational preparation. Damn few of them ever actually make it to nursing school. Most try to find some "accelerated" or "bridge" programme, or more likely, an online programme. And the majority never even finish the prerequisites, much less nursing school. They just spend the rest of their careers talking about how much better they are than nurses. They're only fooling themselves.

And, of course, the latter outnumber the former by about 1000 to 1.

[BEorP]

Seems like we need an FAQ for new members that just says, "It all comes down to education."

[VentMedic]

In our ACLS class (two day) there were 10 medics/4 nurses.

7 medics passed/ 0 nurses passes.

PALS 10 medics/ 3 nurses

6 medics passed/ 0 nurses passed.

Our medic class had no special prep for these courses,

Isn't medic class "prep" for ACLS and PALS?

The certification class should be just a formality to get your "card".

[DwayneEMTP]

I need to clarify I think. When I took the ACLS class we watched a few vids, did a bunch of CPR, but had no instruction (If I remember right, it all gets kind of mashed together in my pea brain) in rhythms, drugs or treatments options.

When I said X nurses/ X medics failed, as Rid stated, I was mistaken. When we ran the mega codes, which we did in teams, they told you right away if you passed or failed, but I didn't realize that the people that failed were held back, and retested later, (which I verified this morning) I had assumed we all got our gear and headed home...

Same with the written test. After it was graded they told everyone that scored 85% or better to go home, the rest to stay. I assumed they were being instructed on where to retake the class, as we were told in our medic class that it wasn't retakable on the same day...

My apologies for claiming my assumptions as facts. Perhaps if everyone else knew that's how it worked, that would explain the retests...I wouldn't have gone crosseyed learning the material in a few days if I knew I could just retest until I got it! (Yeah, well, I probably would have, but you see my point)

Have a great day all.

Dwayne